Guys, I have done quite a bit of mileage on the steamer now and it strikes me as odd that my old Transalp has better wind protection than my steamer. It seems like the standard windshield is lower than the TA's and as the whole thing is narrower, there is more wind from lower on my body and pushing against me.
Have you guys got the same experience and what have you done to improve the situation? (As I do ride long stretches for work, I would like to improve this situation or I will find myself eying other bikes soon...)
Power bronze screen works well. I have one and have never really thought about further wind protection.
I have a slightly higher screen on mine which makes a difference. But never been bothered about wind turbulence. Only seems relevant doing high speed ,,straight line riding? Just tuck down a bit. The pleasure the bike gives otherwise compensates :thumbsup
Quote from: Nick Calne on May 06, 2016, 12:06:37 AM
Power bronze screen works well. I have one and have never really thought about further wind protection.
I did a search for it, but didn't find one on their site for the steamer. :icon_sad:
Quote from: threepot on May 06, 2016, 12:13:42 AM
I have a slightly higher screen on mine which makes a difference. But never been bothered about wind turbulence. Only seems relevant doing high speed ,,straight line riding? Just tuck down a bit. The pleasure the bike gives otherwise compensates :thumbsup
Euhm, yes. That is mostly relevant for high speed straight line riding. Which is what I mean by doing long stretches for work. That generally involves doing 200-400 miles on a day on motorways. And tucking down is fine for a bit, but not for those kind of distances. :icon_wink:
Do you have hand guards?
http://www.m.powerbronze.co.uk/productdetails.aspx?OBJ_ID=906820 (http://www.m.powerbronze.co.uk/productdetails.aspx?OBJ_ID=906820)
Ive got a brand new, unused clear one for half that price, plus postage. Probably get told of for posting in wrong thread, but hey ho. Im a rebel without a clue, me.....
Quote from: London_Phil on May 06, 2016, 07:51:33 PM
Ive got a brand new, unused clear one for half that price, plus postage. Probably get told of for posting in wrong thread, but hey ho. Im a rebel without a clue, me.....
You're more OT than I can usually manage :icon_rolleyes: . Nobody going to the Netherlands in the near future?
Yes, I've got the hand guards. The only question that remains for me is whether the power bronze screen would also help in de width of the air stream. I feel I have less wind on me on my 87 Transalp than on my steamer. And that has the standard low screen as well.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160507/c62b06a7d4f32f832999087796cbc651.jpg)
I'm curious about this topic, never having been a fan of windshields anyway. How fast are you going that you need to have no sense of the air moving by you??
I know what he means. Living in The Netherlands myself as well I am doing around 140km a day on the highway with speeds varying between 100 and 140 km/h. The wind is led to my helmet causing quite a rumble, even with earplugs.
It seems that the windshield on your TA is more vertical causing the wind to be led over your head instead of against your head. I have been looking around for other windshields as well and came across some pictures of someone who has an almost original windscreen but with a small vertical area on top. I'll try to find the picture again.
Like @aeschere says, I often do long stretches of 75/85mph on highways. Usually for at least 2 hours or more. Then it gets tiring. ;)
Yup. Couldn't live without it now. Quieter, warmer and more stable but most of all less tiring. :rrr
I had a Secdem (French) that worked well until I broke it. Next, a PowerBronze. also broken. Now I use the top edge of the Powerbronze just below the tiny stock. screen. Just enough deflection to get a decent dead air space.
Quote from: London_Phil on May 06, 2016, 07:51:33 PM
Ive got a brand new, unused clear one for half that price, plus postage. Probably get told of for posting in wrong thread, but hey ho. Im a rebel without a clue, me.....
Sent you a pm.
Quote from: ghulst on May 07, 2016, 03:41:19 PM
Yes, I've got the hand guards. The only question that remains for me is whether the power bronze screen would also help in de width of the air stream. I feel I have less wind on me on my 87 Transalp than on my steamer. And that has the standard low screen as well.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160507/c62b06a7d4f32f832999087796cbc651.jpg)
Sorry, thread hi-jack. Ahhh, I had a Transalp with exact same colour scheme several years back though Im sure mine was an 89, it had been round the clock too and used as much oil as petrol but would actually sit at 85/90 all day long, not bad for a bike with half the HP of a Tiger, but without being too unkind, I dont miss it
Quote from: fishnbiker on May 08, 2016, 07:22:46 AM
I had a Secdem (French) that worked well until I broke it. Next, a PowerBronze. also broken. Now I use the top edge of the Powerbronze just below the tiny stock. screen. Just enough deflection to get a decent dead air space.
I did pm you about the small screen, didn't I? Or am I losing it?
Quote from: Timbox2 on May 08, 2016, 10:58:09 AM
Sorry, thread hi-jack. Ahhh, I had a Transalp with exact same colour scheme several years back though Im sure mine was an 89, it had been round the clock too and used as much oil as petrol but would actually sit at 85/90 all day long, not bad for a bike with half the HP of a Tiger, but without being too unkind, I dont miss it
No problem. I had an 89 before I got the Tiger. I loved the TA even though my 89 drank oil like an old sailor liquor, but I loved the ease and lightness with which it handled. It just didn't have the power I needed for my long motorway stretches. I then got myself the Tiger and like the power, but missed the lightness of the TA, so I got an 87 three months ago. And I still like that. Also like the character of the engine, but it should have 25hp more. If it had that, I would be happy. ;)
Quote from: Nick Calne on May 08, 2016, 08:08:32 PM
I did pm you about the small screen, didn't I? Or am I losing it?
Not sure if you are losing it, but I didn't get a pm. ;)
Quote from: ghulst on May 08, 2016, 08:29:19 PM
No problem. I had an 89 before I got the Tiger. I loved the TA even though my 89 drank oil like an old sailor liquor, but I loved the ease and lightness with which it handled. It just didn't have the power I needed for my long motorway stretches. I then got myself the Tiger and like the power, but missed the lightness of the TA, so I got an 87 three months ago. And I still like that. Also like the character of the engine, but it should have 25hp more. If it had that, I would be happy. ;)
Not sure if you are losing it, but I didn't get a pm. ;)
Ditch the 'steamer'...get an Africa Twin!! :icon_wink:
Quote from: threepot on May 08, 2016, 09:44:32 PM
Ditch the 'steamer'...get an Africa Twin!! :icon_wink:
That thought has crossed my mind. The trouble is that the Africa Twin has the same oil problem at high mileage and is the same weight as the steamer, but with less power. That means I probably wouldn't feel it would be a good exchange. Even though it would be nice to have father and son in the garage. ;)
I would like that 70-80 hp in a package around 180kg that is light enough to easily throw around like the TA. I even considered the XTZ660, but that has the same 50hp. Or the 690 Adventure. But that is no fun for highway use either. So, I still have the steamer. Honestly, there has been a potential buyer that has come to take a look at it last Saturday, but even though he liked the way it rode, he thought he could get something that didn't have the marks of usage as much as mine. Oh well.
Quote from: ghulst on May 08, 2016, 11:57:14 PM
That thought has crossed my mind. The trouble is that the Africa Twin has the same oil problem at high mileage and is the same weight as the steamer, but with less power. That means I probably wouldn't feel it would be a good exchange. Even though it would be nice to have father and son in the garage. ;)
I would like that 70-80 hp in a package around 180kg that is light enough to easily throw around like the TA. I even considered the XTZ660, but that has the same 50hp. Or the 690 Adventure. But that is no fun for highway use either. So, I still have the steamer. Honestly, there has been a potential buyer that has come to take a look at it last Saturday, but even though he liked the way it rode, he thought he could get something that didn't have the marks of usage as much as mine. Oh well.
Mmm,so in a nutshell,the Tiger's take some beating!! :thumbsup
Quote from: threepot on May 09, 2016, 12:18:24 AM
Mmm,so in a nutshell,the Tiger's take some beating!! :thumbsup
Hahaha, yes, I guess you can say that. :) I mean, it is not the perfect bike, but I'm not sure what will ever be. With the Transalp set up for more playful riding, the Tiger has been assigned the most lengthy trips and high speed runs. That has brought out some weak points in the saddle, the wind protection and the height of the steps. I am sure all can be changed, but that has also triggered my thinking towards other options. However, there aren't many. Either you stay in the same range (Africa Twin, XRV750 Super Ténéré, Cagiva Elephant if you can find one) and you might have some improvements, but it might be cheaper to adapt the Tiger. Or you get towards bigger bikes as the BMW 1100/1150 GS or more travel oriented BMW R1100RS/RT, Honda Pan European etc. And I am not sure I want to go that way. ;)
Quote from: threepot on May 08, 2016, 09:44:32 PM
Ditch the 'steamer'...get an Africa Twin!! :icon_wink:
New or old??
Most people you speak to about adventure bikes want what you just said... Less weight so they can go off road with some confidence, enough power to do some motorway miles.
How long before a manufacturer decides to make that bike? I think the closest is probably the xtz750 but they are very old bikes now.
Quote from: Nick Calne on May 09, 2016, 09:01:16 AM
How long before a manufacturer decides to make that bike? I think the closest is probably the xtz750 but they are very old bikes now.
The trouble with the XTZ750 really is the same as with the Africa Twin. It weighs about the same as the steamer, and has about 5hp less. So, no alternative. To me it really comes down to there being just two groups of interesting bikes, and they are on either side of my personal ideal bike.
Group 1:
Single cilinders, around 50hp and around 180 kilos dry like the Yamaha XTZ660 and XT660Z. The only really difference being the KTM 640 Adventure which comes in at 154kg dry and has 49hp. Or two cilinders for the Honda Transalp and Kawasaki KLE500.
Group 2:
Multiple cilinders (2 and 3) which all weigh around 210 dry and have between 60 and 95hp like the XTV750 Super Ténéré, KTM 950 Adventure, Honda Africa Twin (except for the RD04 which comes in at 185kg dry with 62hp) and the Cagiva Elephant (except the 750 ie which weighs 188 and has 59hp).
Ideally, I would want something in between. Coming in at 170kg max with around 80hp with a twin. But I guess that is an illusion as manufacturers would have probably made one already.
An extra cylinder can't possibly weigh 30kg or so! It must be possible somehow.
I think manufacturers are missing a trick or maybe there is something about volume sales that is not met by the number of us asking for this. ..
Interesting subject, if a bit off topic. Imho the reason we don't see these 'mid range' adv bikes + power to spare is that most riders want the Ewan McCharlie look, even if the only adventure riding they do is the 5 mile commute to work with their lunch sarnies in the topbox, including the odd dodgy overtake to raise the pulse a bit.
The serious (off road/adventure) riders who are going to spend most of their time actually using the bike for what it was built for are going to opt for the lighter ones, and they don't need oodles of hp anyway.
Despite the ribbing I get, Rhoda the Roadie will never wear knobbies and I lack the testicular fortitude to even think about taking her off (paved) road. That was what the XR650 was for, and the XL250 will be for.
My 22 cents worth (2 cents + inflation)
Agreed Nick. On the other hand, we do see manufacturers switch slightly. I mean, BMW's 1200GS Adventure has become a bigger behemoth than the average small car with a price tag to match. I loved Ewan and Charley's Long Way Round/Down and subsequently the first thing I did after getting my license (yes, they did inspire me to get my license at 35), was book a test ride. I loved that 2012 1200GS and would buy one in a heartbeat if I had the money burning a hole in my pocket. However, realism sometimes kicks in and I am well aware that the GS is more of a street than an off road machine. Even though I know some that do take them on off road rides.
I started out with an old XJ600, upgraded to a Transalp and was sold. Allroads are where it is at for me. So, from there you go and look for what you can afford and what gives you the biggest amount of fun. I guess for me, the question is more about "if you had to do it all with one bike, which one would you choose" (I can feel a new topic come up...) (http://www.tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/topic,15509.0.html) After all, I like the Tiger, but less for off road stuff. So I got myself another TA for that. (Yes, I really was looking for a 400-600cc enduro, but I love the TA's and this one came along for a laughable price with fixable problems.)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160509/d18a6594803d699cea058116b00dbc4b.jpg)
The biggest question that remained for me after getting the TA, was whether to keep the Tiger or, as it was going to be used for a long haul tarmac machine anyway, trade it for something like a BWM 1150RT or similar for comfortable high speed cruising.
Dilemmas, dilemmas. ;)
Here in the States, Triumph dealers have become few and far between, so were I ever to buy a new bike, it would probably be one of the new Honda Africa Twins. Do a search for Triumph dealers in Google Maps and then Honda dealers, and you'll see why this is a factor.
Realistically though, I don't think I could ever live without this triple engine. If you've read any of my posts, you'll see that I have spent some time and money getting my Tiger to a point where it seems reliable as a stone, and fits me really well in its role as a long distance touring platform. I have no dirt riding in my past experience, but have been perfectly comfortable with the Tiger on the gravel and dirt roads which I have traveled, so for that eventuality I don't really require better off road attributes from my bike.
I also love the aesthetics of the Steamers, as they just "look the business" to my eye. The rarity of them has me feeling like I belong to an exclusive club (the only time I have seen more than two together was in Mustang's garage), and my buddies on their "sportier" Triumph models certainly never have to wait for me to catch up to them, even in the twisties.
So, I feel like I already own my dream bike.
Now, if Triumph were to import the Tiger Sport here, however...
Interesting that the mods have not leapt in because we are so off topic :icon_wink:
But on topic again. Went to Kamloops and back yesterday, about 240 km round trip. I'm 5'10" (and shrinking with age) but on the 1050 and at highway speed (100kph) + a bit more to allow for speedo inaccuracy, I have no buffeting or discomfort behind the stock screen. I also didn't on the Steamer when I went to Alaska in 2014. And frankly cannot remember any bike with a screen, vestigial or otherwise, that made me even think about it. So am I to infer that if one wants to go at supra legal speed THEN it becomes necessary to have 'better' wind protection??
Or am I just lucky to be the size of rider that the manufacturers are catering for??
Quote from: nickjtc on May 16, 2016, 05:44:31 AM
Or am I just lucky to be the size of rider that the manufacturers are catering for??
I think you might be. I'm not tall either, at 6'1", but compared to the average Joe my legs are shorter and my torso is longer. I have yet to come across a bike with decent wind protection. BMW's 1200GS doesn't have the right screen for me, the Tiger 800 doesn't and even KTM who claimed that the screen on their 1190 would be perfect for anyone couldn't make it work for me. And that hasn't got anything to do with speed, it is just that it gets tiresome when you need to ride 400km stretches. (Heading out to Paris on Thursday, back on Friday for meetings.)
I'm 5'11" with a 30" inseam (that may be the more important factor, since what's left of me is the part above the seat), and I got lots of buffeting from the stock screen. The Powerbronze works well though.
Well, London_Phil's spare Powerbronze screen should be on its way now, so we'll see. I'm afraid it won't be on time for my trip to Paris on Thursday, but it might be on time for my trip to Brussels the week after.
On its way , collected today. Regards, Phil
Great!
I think you'll like it. I'm just a fraction taller than you with the shape you describe and it works for me perfectly.
Good news then. Now it's just the waiting...
The screen came in hours after I left for Paris. Anyway, I've got it now and will put it on before riding to Brussels on Monday. :)
Ok, when mounting the new window, I found out that my fairing support is broken. :( So if anyone has one left over, I'd be interested.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160521/fc5ef3a424d21711fc3010f65d80aacf.jpg)
Before
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160521/79b7e01ea9ea4263bccab6c17fdc3053.jpg)
After
Nick could be your man
http://www.tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/topic,15439.0.html (http://www.tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/topic,15439.0.html)
Do you mean the sub frame?
Yep. You have the two mounting points and then you have the tubes running up and down to meet in the middle. It has broken right above that point. :(
You can either replace with the later, two bar system
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231460196031
Or cut an 8mm bolt shaft down and wedge it up the broken frame pipe like I did many years ago, and stop worrying about it !!!
Quote from: London_Phil on May 21, 2016, 10:56:22 PM
You can either replace with the later, two bar system
What's the difference between them? I mean, are all the mounting points similar etc?
I was thinking of wedging something in there, but as I would need to take the whole thing apart anyway, I might as well just replace it. Also because I saw that one of the bottom brackets seems to be bent as well. That way I get something straight again.
Quote from: GavD on May 21, 2016, 03:43:15 PM
Nick could be your man
http://www.tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/topic,15439.0.html (http://www.tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/topic,15439.0.html)
Yup got one.
Ok, I was going to use the Tiger to go to Brussels, but it is pouring down. :( Choosing to be a softy and take the car instead. There will be other opportunities to test it. Probably Wednesday. ;)
Did a quick run this morning. Got up to 170km/h... No, officer, I only did that imaginary speed...
Anyway, it does relieve the body of a lot of the wind pressure. That is very nice. Downside is that it directs the wind to my head on ear/eye level, so it hasn't gotten any quieter. But it does relieve pressure, so it will make me less tired after a day of riding, I recon.
Glad to hear its an improvement.
So am I. ;)
Ok, a new frame has been in my garage for a couple of weeks now, but I haven't had a chance to put it in. Any tips on the easiest way to take out the old sub frame and putting in the replacement frame?
There's nothing really tricky about it. Only thing I can think of that might trip you up is the cable loom routing, so take plenty of photos before you start.
Be careful with the wires going into the big multi block connectors as they will be stiff to pull apart and the wires may be fragile. Now is a good time to clean the connector terminals up and apply a liberal amount of dielectric grease to keep the crap out.
Good tip. :)
As the Tiger was parked because of the radiator anyway, I decided to bite the bullet and change the subframe. I was a bit apprehensive about this as there's so much wiring in the fairing, but it had to be done.
So, after a while I ended up with this:
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160709/94a1514f9ab9f673eb492244d9eb9d9f.jpg)
And after a full afternoon of hard work, I was back where I started, but with a new subframe. Job done. Fingers hurting. ;)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160709/2e0ef882d7c828a479e38c7e67b358c2.jpg)
I forgot to say, now is also a good time to take the headlamps off and clean out the inside. Nothing harsh, just mild soapy water and those big cotton buds used for removing make up, I don't sleep with mascara on :augie, attached to a chop stick or similar. You'll be amazed at the difference in light output and the muck that comes out.
That's another good tip. We'll see when though. I just put them back on. And it is not a hard job to do. ;)