Surging ...It might be your Throttle Position Sensor is Bad

[EvilBetty]

That makes more sense...

So you pulled the TPS and connected a 12v car charger to it, or you pulled the battery and connected the charger to the battery leads, or gutted a charger and used part of it?  I'm trying to wrap my head around this one :?  Apparently if you don't use it you do in fact loose it.

[Bixxer Bob]

Not battery, I used the charger, which generates a 50hz half-rectified wave form (that's UK mains, USA is probably different - 60hz I think?).  It's not as clean as a signal genny but is adequate.  By moving the TPS I could see disruptions to the wave form which I interpreted as 'noise'.  Of course I could be wrong - I'm no expert at this - I could be making the evidence fit the hypothesis...  The Tuneboy evidence was more compelling I think.

[EvilBetty]

Interesting...

I'll have to test that charger I have and see if it will fit the bill.

[wesseld]

Hi all,

I took my 2006 Tiger (7700 miles) to the dealer yesterday to have them look into the surging problem.  My bike's symptoms are exactly as you have described, with the surging/snatchiness at around 2000 - 2500 rpm.  As expected, they found nothing wrong.  They checked for fault codes (none) and checked the TPS closed throttle position value (zero like it should be) and said that throttle response during the test ride was excellent.  

I mentioned the details in this thread, and they said they believed me, but they found nothing wrong.  They even suggested that I may not be used to the power this bike has.  I've put almost 4000 mile on in 8 months, so while I am not exactly a seasoned Tiger veteran, I am not exactly new to the bike.

Does anyone have a suggestion?  Should I just bite the bullet and order up a new TPS and gasket and do it myself, or take it back to the dealer and have them try harder?

Any ideas would be appreciated!

Thanks,

Don

[Bixxer Bob]

It worked for me, but can't guarrantee it will for you.  It's not expensive though so worth a try.  And certainly a lot easier than playing with maps - which you can do now with the new freeware!!

[LTB]

It worked for me !!!

I've tried a lot of things and the rough running was just getting worse.
With the new TPS and iridium plugs my wonderful bike is back.
In my helmet, no-one cam hear me scream :-)

Thanx for the instructions. Regarding the bolts holding the throttle body, you really need high quality Torx-bits.
Be careful because you need a lot of force to loosen them. I think they are standard 8.8 strength,
a bit stronger than A4 stainless, so I didn't change mine.

I havn't checked the 0-position of the TPS yet but the cable to use with
TuneECU is on the way. No problem driving as it is though.

[Bixxer Bob]

Glad you had a result LTB  

[Wiggus]

Hey Bixxer,
I'm having the exact same trouble up to 4000rpm (1999 885i Tiger), BUT if I do the Triumph 12 minute reset, it runs great for a while, then the hesitations slowly come back. If it's a bad TPS I wouldn't expect the reset to "fix" it. Another big clue is that the bike was running fine after a reset, then I got poured on for about 5-10 minutes and the symptoms returned immediately during the storm. It slowly returned to normal after the rain passed. Some other sensor perhaps?

[Danny955i]

Hey Bixxer,
I'm having the exact same trouble up to 4000rpm (1999 885i Tiger), BUT if I do the Triumph 12 minute reset, it runs great for a while, then the hesitations slowly come back. If it's a bad TPS I wouldn't expect the reset to "fix" it. Another big clue is that the bike was running fine after a reset, then I got poured on for about 5-10 minutes and the symptoms returned immediately during the storm. It slowly returned to normal after the rain passed. Some other sensor perhaps?

My guess is TPS... I'm having the same troubles as you and have plugged my bike into TuneECU only to find my throttle is at 0, but my AF/1 map boxes jump and my idle is never EVER steady... I have it set to 1250 over 90 degrees, and it wanders between 1050 and 1230, never hitting 1250 and never staying still.

I just ordered the gasket and sensor from BikeBandit.com.... should take a month to get here (Back-order) and cost about 70 bucks. Worth it in my opinion.

[Bixxer Bob]

Danny, your wandering tickover is symptomatic of air leaks, which can be the gasket, IACV hoses or a sticky IACV itself.

I know you've got massive airflow on your Tiger but having said that folks like Chris Canning are runnning the airbox with the baffle torn out so I wouldn't think that is your problem alone.

Some questions to ask yourself  (not really for you Danny as you've already covered most of this but for others reading it later):

Is the IACV working ok?  Hook up TuneECU and cycle the IACV, it should move to the limits of its range of movement without any glitches.

Is the pipework sound?  The IACV corrugated pipes can have small splits in them which are almost impossible to see so a little pressure test might be in order (block one end, fit a bit more tube to the other,submerge them in water and blow through them).

Likewise, the plastic sleeves that connect the pipes to the IACV and throttle bodies can get a bit tired, make sure they don't leak either.

If you have a Scottoiler hooked up to one of the IACV tubes make sure there's no leaks on that pipe either.  Might be worth disconnecting Scottoiler and blanking off the T piece....

Hook up the tank while the airbox is off.  Is there any difference in the lumpiness?

As the throttle bodies have to come off and also to do the gasket, change the TPS and gasket at the same time.  It's a few quid, and it might be one or the other, but why do the work twice?

When you've done the gasket and TPS, and put the airbox back on, make sure it seals properly around the IACV (mine didn't - I ended up making a 6mm gasket out of closed cell foam) you can check by removing the air filter and looking down into the airbox.  Also make sure the white plastic elbow that takes the pipe that goes to the ECU (rear right hand side of the box) seals in its grommet properly.  I didn't think it mattered, but it does.  Likewise the hose from the crankcase (under right rear of airbox).

Having done all of this at some point or other, and changed the crank sensor, and extensively reworked the fuel maps mine runs as better than it's ever done, but it's not perfect.  I'm convinced now that when I'm trying to do 30 mph at around 2500 - 3000 rpm and it starts to hesitate, it's not the maps or anything else.  It's simply the ECU doesn't know what to do with the fuel on a steady throttle and light engine load and is constantly under and over fuelling.

Just had a brainstorm ...   :?:   if the chain is incorrectly adjusted ie too slack, and is whipping about under a light load, that would constantly change the load on the engine maybe leading to the snatching.  Clutching at straws  maybe but it's worth looking into. :)

[cosmo]

Lets not overlook the obvious (and cheap). I just replaced my filter (K&N, so sue me), hogged out the airbox restrictor, and replaced the plugs (NGK, same as stock).

Bike does not surge anymore. Picks up cleanly from 1500 rpm under load. and is a good deal more powerful.

I think I may have had a sparking plug going off, as well as flow problems with the stock filter (installed backwards from new).

YMMV. '06 Tigger

Cosmo