Starter motor or relay?

[haroldo_psf]

I am about to go on a very long ride in a month and a half, and remembered there is some nuance I may want to address.

For the past 6 months to a year, when starting the bike, I may have to push the started button and clutch two or three times before the starter motor turns on.

The important detail in this is that, in the failed attempts, I do hear a cliking sound coming from the dash board area (not 100% sure about the area, but that's where it seems to be coming from).

So, in summary:

- when starting the bike, sometimes (most times) I pull the clutch and push the started button. I hear a click, but starter doesn't come on.
- I then let clutch go, pull it back in again, push starter button again, it clicks, and starter motor comes on.

Sometimes it works the first time. Sometimes it takes two attempts or so. It does start always though, without fail, that's why I haven't worried about it, and it hasn't gotten worse (the number of attempts needed hasn't gone up).

So, questions:

- if I do hear the click sound every time, does that mean the relay is OK and the starter motor is the problem?

- If the relay could still be the issue, where is it located?

[PeteH]

The clicking sound is probably the starter solonoid located at the rear of the battery box.

I had some trouble with same symtoms and eventually it died. Problem was located to a dodgy wire/crimp connection on the clutch switch connecter block. Open and short circuiting the block didnt show anything up only a continuity check to block behind the dash found the problem.

Might be worth checking out?

[haroldo_psf]

where is the clutch switch connector block?

Where did you do a continuity check from and to?

if I wanted to bypass the switch, short wires somewhere so it always sees the clutch pulled in (no need to pull clutch to start), where would I do it?

[PeteH]

Got to out shortly, hopefully get some more up later if not too late, otherwise tomorrow.

[TigerTrax]

Check your ignition switch for loose wire, cracked solder, ...
you have to take it apart.....

[PeteH]

It should be a reasonably quick check to make so here goes...

Remove the screen and cockpit.

Locate the clutch switch connector (2 wires)to the left bar switch gear harness...its under a plastic shroud near the headstock.

Trace the harness to the cockpit and release it from the main wiring loom

Disconnect the  clutch switch connector.

Check for continuity of the cable between the two connector blocks, black one was the problem if memory serves me right.

You could always pop the blade out of the connector and inspect it...as it was at this joint where my trouble lay. The joint looked solid but water ingress had rotted the wire, just remade the joint with a bit of solder.

Hope this helps

[haroldo_psf]

thanks a lot guys. I'll give it a go this wekend.

[haroldo_psf]

yup, it was the clutch swtich. I tested continuity on the switch terminals, and it was very badly intermitent.

That switch is an annoyance anyway, never liked having to pull the clutch to start the bike, even in neutral.

I cut the wires, soldered them together, heat shrink, and voila! The bike starts every time now, without fail, and I don't have to pull the clutch in!

 :lol:

[PeteH]

Glad you got it sorted,  but a new switch is only £11 =$?

[haroldo_psf]

Glad you got it sorted,  but a new switch is only £11 =$?

I knew the new switch is dirt cheap. It's not the money. It's really the way it works which I never liked. I can understand having a safety switch on the kick stand. Sure. But the safety switch on the clutch lever was just stupid. Come on. If you try to turn on the motorcycle in first gear without pulling in the clutch, you deserve to land on your a$$ :)

It lost count of the times I had something on one hand, and had to lay it down just so I could pull the clutch to hit the starter and warm up the bike in my garage. It's a redundant annoyance that adds absolutely no value for me, at least. So I took the opportunity to "fix" it  :lol:

[Mustang]

does the side stand have to be up or will it start in gear with the stand down ?
you may not have actually had anything wrong with your clutch switch and could simply have a bad relay ................all you have done is bypassed the relay sort of .
with a safety system that is functioning properly you DO NOT need to pull the clutch to start in neutral.

[PeteH]

does the side stand have to be up or will it start in gear with the stand down ?
you may not have actually had anything wrong with your clutch switch and could simply have a bad relay ................all you have done is bypassed the relay sort of .
with a safety system that is functioning properly you DO NOT need to pull the clutch to start in neutral.

From what I can tell from the Haynes manual, the sidestand is wired to the ECM and the clutch switch is the ground -v for the starter solenoid..so the clutch must be pulled to allow starting, either with the stand up or down.

By by-passing the switch could the bike move with the stand down??

[Mustang]

does the side stand have to be up or will it start in gear with the stand down ?
you may not have actually had anything wrong with your clutch switch and could simply have a bad relay ................all you have done is bypassed the relay sort of .
with a safety system that is functioning properly you DO NOT need to pull the clutch to start in neutral.

From what I can tell from the Haynes manual, the sidestand is wired to the ECM and the clutch switch is the ground -v for the starter solenoid..so the clutch must be pulled to allow starting, either with the stand up or down.

By by-passing the switch could the bike move with the stand down??

oops I was looking at a steamer diagram
will a Girly start in neutral without having to pull clutch?

[haroldo_psf]

does the side stand have to be up or will it start in gear with the stand down ?
you may not have actually had anything wrong with your clutch switch and could simply have a bad relay ................all you have done is bypassed the relay sort of .
with a safety system that is functioning properly you DO NOT need to pull the clutch to start in neutral.

From what I can tell from the Haynes manual, the sidestand is wired to the ECM and the clutch switch is the ground -v for the starter solenoid..so the clutch must be pulled to allow starting, either with the stand up or down.

By by-passing the switch could the bike move with the stand down??

oops I was looking at a steamer diagram
will a Girly start in neutral without having to pull clutch?

 No, it won't. Clutch has to be in when starting in any gear or neutral. That's why it's stupid. I assumed in my earlier post that the "logical" reason from Triumph why clutch has to be in would be so riders don't accidentally start the bike in gear.

[iansoady]

The daft thing is that in gear with the clutch pulled in the starter motor will turn but no feed to ignition / fuel injection.

Can be a little embarrassing looking for a non-existent fault.....