Re: "Alternative to 12 minute tune" update (now called the "Adaptive Tune") discussion

[Chris Canning]

Rather than start another thread John boy whats the latest Triumph tune?? just loaded the bike in the van to take to the dealer so I'll find out fairly soon if it's any good.

[Bixxer Bob]

No-one's released any for ages now.  I'd guess that the dealer will stick with the stock 10173 (post VIN with TOR pipe or equivalent).


I can't remember what year yours is Chris....

[Chris Canning]

I can't remember when I had the last map blown in either the end of 10 or maybe 11,but even just by starting the bike up it's different good/bad??,will probably ride it to Silverstone on Friday and find out.

[Bixxer Bob]

Last time you didn't like it because it was vibey, but it settled down once it had trimmed itself back.  Why have it mapped this time?

[Chris Canning]

Your right it was and I was hoping that this would be the same but it doesn't have that zing that the other had which is what I was after but riding to Le-Mans is a competitive experience I ride with two other guys they are one up with a rucksack on their back I'm two up with a pile of gear and it need little bit of performance I can squeeze out of it.

The irony all three of us hate riding in a group I find it a complete pain and so do they but for convenience sake we do but it can get pretty gung ho at times,I/we could go on the K but we are heading south after Le-Mans the Tiger is a far better bet on the back roads of France and Spain.

[DavidR8]

I've written this because editing some posts from the old forum is not possible.

I found some more on the 12 minute tune alternative tonight.  The information I have been given suggests that the standard 12 minute tune is for pre- O2 sensor bikes and that the alternative that I posted is actually the process for bikes that have an O2 sensor.

Also, it states that the idle trim buttons are also for pre-O2; the O2 sensor versions don't need it as they adapt themselves.  Adaptation can be forced using the alternative to 12 minute tune (from here on in know as "Adaptive tune" as I can't be arsed to keep typing out the full description.  It doesn't say that the trim buttons don't work for the O2 bikes just that they are redundant.  I'll have to dig the gas analyser out and have a play.  Of course, if you're running a map that stops the O2 sensor trimming the settings, you'll need to do it manually.

This stuff doesn't get any easier eh?

I have some experience with this type of thing from FI Bonnie. With the 06 955, I'm a bit out of my depth.

She seems to start fine, goes to high idle, settles down after a bit then idles along at about 1,000 rpm or so. Pulls good and strong (coming from 68 HP, this is relative!) pops and snap a bit on the overrun.

What I do notice is that when I come to a stop there is a strong exhaust odour, like a engine running rich. Every time I smell it, I look around to see what beater car/truck is responsible. 

But I think the odour is coming from me, well my bike to be exact.

From what I recall of my air cooled VW days, popping on the overrun could be caused by an overly rich mix igniting post-combustion chamber.

Is it possible that the tune is a bit off? My bike is stone stock with a fresh tappet check and new plugs.

[Bixxer Bob]

David,  firstly, the popping;  it's caused by weak mixture, not rich.  The mixture is too weak to burn completely before the exhaust valve opens so you get a pop into the exhaust pipe.  If it was unburned fuel in the pipe you'd get a loud bang, such as when a carb'd Suzuki Bandit rider hits his kill switch momentarily to show off.

The rich smell could be how the previous owner had it set up.  You'll need TuneECU and a cable to see what's in there.

[Chris Canning]

Sounds just like the map I've just had blown in,I've only hammered it down the motorway and as I've learned before what feels great for 20 miles can really get on your tits another 200 down the road so we'll see,but it does go well  ,even if the poping is a tad disconcerting and I've never had that before but all part of the adventure!!!.

Thinking about it I had a map blown in around 2004 it was doing over 60 to the gallon at 100 mph trouble being I had industrial white finger with the vibration it was running that weak by the time I got to the ferry 

[DavidR8]

On a different but related note, does the O2 sensor ever need to be replaced? I've done this as part of diagnosing an FI problem on my truck and a new sensor alone made a world of difference.

[Bixxer Bob]

I've not heard of anyone doing it but it's an interesting point.  The software we use will let you see the sensor voltage but of course that doesn't mean it's in calibration....  The Tiger sensor is narrow band so it shows 0.46v engine off and swings 0v to 0.9v but whether it's sensing the gases correctly when it swings is possibly a source of some fuelling problems.

[Chris Canning]

I'd go with what Bixxer says,although oddly enough I might have a scout around the house for 02 plug,the beauty of the early 955's the connection is at the back of the motor so takes seconds to plug in,in the past I've found it takes the edge off the motor but I'll have to try it again.

[Bixxer Bob]

Last time you mentioned it, it was in the paperclip tray on your desk.......

[DavidR8]

I've not heard of anyone doing it but it's an interesting point.  The software we use will let you see the sensor voltage but of course that doesn't mean it's in calibration....  The Tiger sensor is narrow band so it shows 0.46v engine off and swings 0v to 0.9v but whether it's sensing the gases correctly when it swings is possibly a source of some fuelling problems.

Woohoo! I have contributed knowledge to the collective as compared to only sucking knowledge out....

[Bixxer Bob]

I've not heard of anyone doing it but it's an interesting point.  The software we use will let you see the sensor voltage but of course that doesn't mean it's in calibration....  The Tiger sensor is narrow band so it shows 0.46v engine off and swings 0v to 0.9v but whether it's sensing the gases correctly when it swings is possibly a source of some fuelling problems.

Woohoo! I have contributed knowledge to the collective as compared to only sucking knowledge out....

  Well done 

Seriously though,  this is how collective knowledge works.  The experience doesn't have to be all Tiger it can come from anywhere and make a difference. I sometimes think that if the original guys from Triumph that put the Tiger FI together  saw the discussion on the forums, and some of the rubbish that is touted as fact, they'd wet themselves laughing at what we think is going on.  Well, they'd laugh till they remembered they are responsible for the crap fuelling we're all trying to improve.  Personally, I won't say something is fact unless I read it in a Triumph document; I usually put ideas and theories out there for comment or to provoke further input, such as yours.   :icon_wink: