Steel Line Folly

[Dyn Blin]

'Came across a great offer a few weeks back on locally fabbed brake lines at a local shop "practicing" for track builds by volunteering to be a "beta".  Similar in appearance to Galfer: Steel stranded braids sandwiched between a Teflon line and protective PVC sleeve.  I've been looking forward to installing them, and as part of the weekend maintenance on some other items, figured they would be a quick job.

It was a pretty easy exercise in the swap.  Bleeding was not too tough with my livestock syringe & 1/4" tubing.  Finished off for good measure with an engaged brake grab for a few hours & a few gentle taps on the line and calipers to float out any remaining bubbles.

I drained the old lines and bagged them.  Then I threw them into the "Box-o-Parts" that will likely sit on the garage shelf until I'm relocated in the Robot Uprising.  When the landed in the box, I head a loud "click".   I peered in, wondering what I'd hit.  As I pulled the bag back out, up came a magnetized oil plug with it.

I suppose I like the "cleaner" look of 2 dedicated lines instead of that bodge-job-looking carry over from the right side over the fender to the left caliper, but can anyone else verify the OEM's were/are steel inside the plastic jacket for the Girlies (mine is a 2005)?

[Bixxer Bob]

 

[Dyn Blin]

Well, at least the brake fluid is clean.   

Maybe a good excuse for a raised fender now, too.

Single lines:  The "Gateway Farkle"?

[Ossian]

Hello DB. I have aquired a new Tiger 800 m/c (14mm) and adjustable lever and along with that plan to fit the twin lines like you have done. Have you noticed any change in brake "feel" ?

[Dyn Blin]

Love your epic poems!

Besides a proper bleed, the best piece of work to change the feel of my front brake system was to rebuild the master cylinder and calipers last year.  I  used kits from Sprint Manufacturing.  Given my then- decade-old tiger was likely in sore need of the care, I'm not sure you might expect the same outcome with your newer ride.

At the risk of getting this booted to the 800 forum, I have a buddy that used one of their kits to "upgrade" the master cylinder on his 800 to 5/8" from 14mm, and his handle travel is much diminished with a greater feel to the "bite" of the pads.  It was pricey though, and I imagine one could get the same result by searching for salvage 5/8 Nissin set at a deep savings.

[Ossian]

Sorry DB, maybe my post wasn't clear. I am fitting a 14mm Tiger 800 Nissin cylinder to my 2003 955i. At the moment the brakes are working fine, I'm just not keen on the soft feel of the lever, which is why I asked about the effect of your change to twin lines.
The standard cylinder is only 1/2" and I considered the other options, but decided that a 5/8" cylinder (which is used on twin 4 pot fronts) would end up being far too hard on the 955i twin 2 pot set-up.
The cylinder I am going to use is a brand new ebay job, so a big saving.

[Dyn Blin]

Ah, understood now, thanks.

To the point:  I note only a modest improvement in "feel" of grab or lever travel. 

I presume there's not more improvement due to the fact that the OEM lines were steel too, as confirmed by Bixxer Bob,& line flex wasn't likely an issue before or after the swap.  Overall relative length of lines are similar, if not a little longer in the new set up, so fluid friction isn't much of a consideration.  I didn't consider or review the internal diameter of the lines before the swap, but would guess they are similar.

I've put on a good amount of miles over the year since I rebuilt the master cylinder and calipers, so I'm not willing to attribute the marginal improvement to much more than the fluid swap and bleed at this point.

If it was me, I'd try the new master cylinder with the existing lines to see if you get the improvement you're looking for, before going with the additional expense of a 2 dedicated line set up. 

I'm very interested to hear of your results.

[Ossian]

Well, I'm off today for a few days touring the west coast of Ireland and plan to do the swap when I return, so I'll see how it goes and let you know.

[Sin_Tiger]

The hydraulics are simple enough but from personal experience the key to getting both effective braking and feel/control,  is getting a good combination of pad and disc. My own preferred make is EBC for both but others have found other combinations.

[Ossian]

Well, I've just covered a few hundred miles with the standard set up and I am quite happy with the brake performance except for the issue of lever travel. I can't risk needing to brake hard using two fingers as the other fingers can get trapped between lever and bar stopping full braking. If I use the four fingers on the lever all works well though the lever ends up almost touching the bar at that stage.
In circumstances where ultra rapid response to a situation is required that is not ideal.

[Sin_Tiger]

Time for a master cylinder rebuild 

[Ossian]

Time for a master cylinder rebuild 

No, that's not the answer in this case. The brakes have always worked fine but there has always been too much lever travel right from new. The standard 1/2" cylinder is always going to be like that.
So this

is what I'll be fitting. It's the 14mm cylinder as used on the 800 Tiger, and comes as standard with an adjustable lever.
Eventually I'll also do the twin line mod as described by DynBlin.

[Sin_Tiger]

Never had a stock master cylinder come back to the grip like that that I couldn't sort. Curious if you know the answer why you're asking 

[Ossian]

Umm. I was merely asking DynBlin if the twin line installation had any effect on the feel of the brakes.
Anyway, I have installed the 14mm master cylinder and it certainly firms everything up nicely. Now to get a few miles on the bike to test it for real.

[Sin_Tiger]

Understood. It's always a difficult comparison new for old (see the tyre discussions  ) interested to hear hire it goes just the same.