'96 Steamer questions

[garrett]

So I am new to the site and Tigers and haven't really ridden in quite some time.

I picked up a red '96 Tiger with 11K on it from Oregon last week.  Nice bike, never dropped and overall great shape.  Came with D&D pipes and Thunderbike crash bars.  All for $1,800.  I'm happy.  

My plans are to paint the bike as I am not a huge fan of the graphics and the red isn't doing it for me.  I am also going to install a taller touring screen, a center stand, dual sport tires and plenty of other goodies along the way.  

My questions are:

1) The D&D pipes are a little loud.  I know, I know.  I'm only 39!  haha.  I was considering putting stock pipes back on.  Will the power loss be that significant?  I don't want scooter quiet, but I'd prefer a nice rumble on the highway rather than H-D style motoring.  

2) I bought the bike from Oregon and upon getting it on the road the bike stumbles pretty bad.  The elevation change from Medford, OR to Northern VA (where I live) isn't that much different, so I am ruling out carbs being out of adjustment and hoping it's old/bad/water in the fuel.  The bike hasn't been ridden in a while and I plan on trying that first.  Not to mention it's very low on fuel, so maybe it's picking up the "bad" fuel.  (My new Shoei hasn't arrived yet!)  The PO stated he had the carbs rebuilt - when I am not sure.  

3) Anything else I need to look for or keep an eye on?

I am use to all things British as I have been hoarding Land Rovers for the past 12 years.  I am hoping this Tiger won't give me high blood pressure like the Land Rovers.  :)  

Thanks in advance and I look forward to many years of motoring with this bike.  

Cheers,

Garrett

[D-Fuzz]

Oregon must be the land o' plenty for low mile Steamers.  I bought mine from there last month, only 9000 miles on the clock.  When I got mine, it had some of the same symptoms you describe.  In the end, the carbs needs to be taken off and given a really good cleaning as they were pretty gummed up.  The PO told me the carbs had been rebuilt as well, but I don't think that was the case.  The little o-rings in my carbs were all dried out as well and needed to be replaced.  The bike runs like a champ now.

For what it is worth, I would repaint the bike.  I realise you got it for pretty cheap, but to me, a repainted bike loses a significant amount of its value.  Down the road, if you decided to sell it, you'd get a lot more customers with an original bike than a repainted one.  Just my 2 cents there.

[Mustang]

the power difference between the d&d's and the stock pipe is very minute ,
the noise level on the other hand is extreme ....stealth mode is quite nice . :D

clean out the pilot jets and pilot circuit in the carbs ..it will make a huge difference .

[garrett]

Good to know.  I think I will swap in the stock pipes.  

I don't need to scare puppies and babies every time I fire it up.  :)  

Will get to cleaning the carbs next week.

Thanks,

Garrett

[garrett]

I should have looked at it earlier, but I noticed that both intakes are open and the right hand side is NOT covered.  Before I dive into the carbs this weekend, what kind of issues occur because of this?  

I thought I had some bad gas in the bike with low fuel level as the bike rode great after a fill up, but quickly (about 5 miles) went back to cutting out really bad.  It idles perfect.  

I suppose I can cap the right side with a temp cover and see any differences it makes.  

Thanks

[Colonel Nikolai]

I should have looked at it earlier, but I noticed that both intakes are open and the right hand side is NOT covered.  Before I dive into the carbs this weekend, what kind of issues occur because of this?  

I thought I had some bad gas in the bike with low fuel level as the bike rode great after a fill up, but quickly (about 5 miles) went back to cutting out really bad.  It idles perfect.  

I suppose I can cap the right side with a temp cover and see any differences it makes.  

Thanks

Neither of my '96 triumphs run well at all without one side capped. They lose power around 3000 rpms or so with a hard stumble.

[Mustang]

I should have looked at it earlier, but I noticed that both intakes are open and the right hand side is NOT covered.  Before I dive into the carbs this weekend, what kind of issues occur because of this?  

I thought I had some bad gas in the bike with low fuel level as the bike rode great after a fill up, but quickly (about 5 miles) went back to cutting out really bad.  It idles perfect.  

I suppose I can cap the right side with a temp cover and see any differences it makes.  

Thanks

will run at idle great
willrun ok up to about 4500 rpm then cut out or break up badly(too mch air and not enuff fuel

if the previous owner had it rejetted it may run extremely rich with the snorkel capped

if your mikunis are stock jetting they will have 105's for main jets and the pilots are probably going to be 38's
the needles should be in the center notch for stock
the pilot screws should be at about 1 1/2 turns out from closed

if they have 40's for pilots it will be fine also

if your main jets are bigger like 115's than it has been rejetted to run with the snorkel open on both sides

rejetting on a steamer because the snorkels are opened usually only makes  a mikuni get worse mileage and not really any additional power

mikunis came pretty spot on from the factory , maybe just a tad lean on the pilot circuit , 40's or opening the pilot screws to 2 or 2 1/2 turns fixes the lean pilot

if the bike has sat around without running for awhile you need to clean out the varnish from old gas and probably pay close attention to make sure the pilot jets are open and not plugged

[D-Fuzz]

will run at idle great
willrun ok up to about 4500 rpm then cut out or break up badly(too mch air and not enuff fuel

if the previous owner had it rejetted it may run extremely rich with the snorkel capped

if your mikunis are stock jetting they will have 105's for main jets and the pilots are probably going to be 38's
the needles should be in the center notch for stock
the pilot screws should be at about 1 1/2 turns out from closed

if they have 40's for pilots it will be fine also

if your main jets are bigger like 115's than it has been rejetted to run with the snorkel open on both sides

rejetting on a steamer because the snorkels are opened usually only makes  a mikuni get worse mileage and not really any additional power

mikunis came pretty spot on from the factory , maybe just a tad lean on the pilot circuit , 40's or opening the pilot screws to 2 or 2 1/2 turns fixes the lean pilot

if the bike has sat around without running for awhile you need to clean out the varnish from old gas and probably pay close attention to make sure the pilot jets are open and not plugged

Interesting...When I got my Tigger, it didn't start very well and idled poorly, but ran great from 2500rpm on.  When I took it apart to have the carbs cleaned, I noticed the snorkle on the RH side was open.  I read here that it was supposed to be closed, so I covered it back up.  Since then, the bike has run great, but I do notice it runs a little rich, evidence by the black soot at the talipipes.  I have also noticed my gas mileage has been a little on the poor side.  In looking through the service records I got with the bike, I seem to remember something about the PO having 110 main jets installed.  It seems to make sense now.  I guess I will open up that snorkle again and see what happens.

[garrett]

Ok.  Good info.  Thank you.

I spoke to the PO last night.  He stated that the carbs were cleaned and adjusted 3 months ago.  I know it had been done, but didn't know when.  

He didn't ride it much after the work was done.  Am I kidding myself in thinking there could be another reason for this issue?

[CoolHandLuke]

Ok.  Good info.  Thank you.

I spoke to the PO last night.  He stated that the carbs were cleaned and adjusted 3 months ago.  I know it had been done, but didn't know when.  

He didn't ride it much after the work was done.  Am I kidding myself in thinking there could be another reason for this issue?

Hi.

Excuse me if I have missed this.  Can you tell us when the engine seems to struggle?  Is it at a certain rev range, or when the throttle is held open for a sustained period of time?

This would be my check list:

With standard carbs one side of the air box should be blocked else this causes the engine to splutter at higher revs.  The airboxes are not exactly air tight, but ensure the rubbers are in place and that the drain hose is in place and is blocked with a rubber insert at the bottom.

Check the rubbers are not perished between the engine and the carbs.

When the engine struggles, can you look at the rev counter.  If the rev counter drops to zero, the pickup sensor is at fault.

Check the fuel tap is not blocked and that the filter inside the tank is clean.  I had this problem.  There was crap in the tap that only obstructed the flow periodically.

Check the plugs, coils and HT leads.  (coils should read 6 ohms resistance across the '-' and '+').

Check the filter on the carb.  It is located inside the hose at the carb end of the fuel hose from the tank to the carbs.

Double check the carbs pilot screws and ensure the carbs are balanced.  Also check the vacuum caps are in place on top of the carbs (probably should be higher up the list).

If the problem persists, I would be looking to strip the carbs regardless of any previous work I was notified of - this may even have been the start of the problem.

[garrett]

Thanks again for the good information.  I have a crazy work schedule this week, but have most of next week to mess around with the bike.  I'll be able to go through all your suggestions and check them off.

Thanks again and I will post back soon with my findings.

Cheers

[garrett]

I failed to mention though that the bike seems to struggle anytime it's under throttle.  It idles just fine, but once it's under load it sputters really bad.  I can't really say what particular RPM band is worse.  It will sputter cruising down my gravel road at 10-20 mph and it will do the same (more pronounced) at 4-5K RPM at higher speeds.  It appears to lessen with less throttle though at highway speeds.

This isn't a minor "sputter" or rough engine, but it will cut out pretty bad for a split second at a time and then build up some power and then back off again.  

The bike will run at 80+ mph with no issues.  It will get there, but far from smooth.

[Mustang]

put a multi meter on the coils you should see .6 ohms across the coil terminals

same for the ignition pick up sensor on the crank the plug is under the airbox you should see .6 ohms across the plug

if out of range theres your problem

if it's in range then its valve clearances or carbs

keep in mind though that even they check .6 ohms on the coils they can still be  bad

[Bixxer Bob]

..keep in mind though that even they check .6 ohms on the coils they can still be  bad

Same goes for the crank sensor..... :roll:

[garrett]

So I finally had some time to get the plastic off and start getting this figured out today.  

The short rubber hose from the middle carb to the motor appeared to have buckled itself on the carb side.  Not sure how this would happen, but the edge of the hose was tucked up a bit and bulging out on one side.  An apparent gap was seen.  

Not sure if I did this while fixing the hose, but the arm that connects all three carbs was bent at the end and was not connecting to the third carb.  I am GUESSING I did that while prying the hose around.  

Left all my tools at work, so I should know more during the middle of the week.