Neutral Switch

[97tiger885]

I think my neutral switch has failed.  The '97 will only start if I have the clutch disengaged regardless of whether I have the mc in neutral or not.  Occasionally, the mc will start in neutral if I pull in the clutch, hit the starter, release the clutch and hit the starter again.  Very, very occasionally.  I'm thinking neutral switch, but Henry James' post "Starting Issues" of Feb 2011 has me thinking it may not be the neutral switch.  And Mustang's post tells me I need to drop the bottom of the engine to access the plug.  So, it is not a simple plug-and-play fix.  The switch is about $50US.  Is there a simple way to determine if it is the starter switch?  (Be very clear.  I am an electrical idiot.  It's all smoke to me.)  If it is the switch, how difficult is it to drop the sump?  (I have the centerstand.)  I am tempted to use Cool Hand Luke's workaround from Feb 2010 ("Quick Fix: Side Stand..."), but it disables the sidestand switch as well as the neutral switch.  And I like the sidestand switch as I occasionally try to start the mc with the stand down.  Help.

[JetdocX]

I can't remember and my wiring diagrams are at home, but isn't there also a clutch switch?  I'd go there first.

[Mustang]

if your light comes on when in neutral it's not the switch in the sump
it's the clutch switch more than likely ........it could be as simple as green crud on the brass contacts  . my money is on clutch switch

[CoolHandLuke]

As Mustang has said, if the neutral light comes on, then Neutral is fine, so rule that out.

TEST 1 (with the sidestand down):
With the bike in neutral, and without pulling in the clutch lever see if it will start.
With the bike in neutral, and the clutch lever pulled in, see if it will start.

TEST 2 (with the sidestand up):
With the bike in neutral, and without pulling in the clutch lever see if it will start.
With the bike in neutral, and the clutch lever pulled in, see if it will start.

Can you let me know if it consistently starts in any of these scenarios?

[97tiger885]

As Mustang has said, if the neutral light comes on, then Neutral is fine, so rule that out.

Thanks. That makes me feel much, much better.  The neutral light is coming on. I will start with the clutch switch; although, I think I have already replaced that once.  

+++++++
Jon

[CoolHandLuke]

Try those tests I posted.  If it consistently starts on any of those, let me know.

[97tiger885]

As Mustang has said, if the neutral light comes on, then Neutral is fine, so rule that out.

TEST 1 (with the sidestand down):
With the bike in neutral, and without pulling in the clutch lever see if it will start.
With the bike in neutral, and the clutch lever pulled in, see if it will start.

TEST 2 (with the sidestand up):
With the bike in neutral, and without pulling in the clutch lever see if it will start.
With the bike in neutral, and the clutch lever pulled in, see if it will start.

Can you let me know if it consistently starts in any of these scenarios?

Here are the results of your tests.  Test 1: no, yes.  Test 2: no, yes.  In other words, it starts with the clutch pulled in no matter the position of the sidestand or gear position.  It does not start with the clutch not pulled in no matter the position of the sidestand or gear position.  

I searched my maintenance records and found no receipt for a clutch sensor switch; so, this is probably the original.

[CoolHandLuke]

97tiger885.

From that test, I am 99% certain it is your sidestand switch.

You should run a wire from the negative of your battery to the black wire on the block connector under your seat until you get a replacement.

[CoolHandLuke]

Actually, I take that back...

I have just looked at the circuit diagram again.

It does look like it will be the switch.

Pull the connector out from the underneath the clutch and use a paperclip to bridge the Light Green/White and Yellow/Green wires.  You should be able to start it in neutral, if the switch is at fault.

[97tiger885]

Actually, I take that back...

Pull the connector out from the underneath the clutch and use a paperclip to bridge the Light Green/White and Yellow/Green wires.  You should be able to start it in neutral, if the switch is at fault.

Temps have dropped into the low 40s here again and will stay there for another week or so.  Once it warms up a bit, I will scrounge up a paperclip.  Thanks for the help.

++++++++++
Jon

[97tiger885]

Actually, I take that back...

Pull the connector out from the underneath the clutch and use a paperclip to bridge the Light Green/White and Yellow/Green wires.  You should be able to start it in neutral, if the switch is at fault.

CLH,

I lied.  The sun was out and a paperclip was staring me down. I decided on some electrical misadventure.  I couldn't remember where this switch was; so, I removed the handguard and the clutch handle.  Unnecessarily, as it turns out.  I pulled the harness out of the switch, rolled back the cover and found a problem. My three wires are black/red, black and black/yellow.  I got out the service manual, looked up the electrical diagram (16.53) and looked for the clutch switch.  No such thing.  Forty-five minutes later I did find the Starter Cut-out Relay which had three wires: B/R, B and B/Y.  The box in the diagram had an arrow between B/R and B:  B/R--> B.  I guessed this meant a closed-circuit, i.e. the mc will start with this circuit closed.  I bridged the B/R and B wires with my paperclip, put the mc in neutral and it started.  Of course, the mc is now starting in neutral.  I'll see how long that lasts.  But I now know how to test this swithch.  Wahooooo!

++++++
Jon

[CoolHandLuke]

Cool.  At least you got it going, and with a bit of your own ingenuity too :)