I stopped by the local Wal-Mart this afternoon to buy a gallon of Rotella T 5W-40 synthetic (as enthusiastically recommended here) in anticipation of doing an oil/filter change in the next couple weeks. They were out of the Rotella T gallons, priced at $22 (they had some quarts), but they had, and I bought, a 5 qt jug of Mobil 1 15W-50 ($26).
Is that OK to use in the '01 Tiger? The only reason I ask is because the label says it has "extra anti-wear protection" and I wanted to be sure it wasn't known to cause any wet clutch problems. It does not say on the little circular API label that it's "energy conserving".
BTW- the lady in Wally World auto said that they weren't expecting to get any more Mobil 1 in stock. Most of types of Mobil 1 jugs were sold out. If it's a good oil for the Tiger, I'll go back and snag the last one.
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Please be nice to the noobie, Mustang. I actually did do some forum searching before posting the question.
The posts keep talking about using "Mobil 1 4T 15W-50". But, I don't see 4T on this jug at all. All I really need to know is if it's the same stuff others are using successfully in their bikes (which I suspect and hope it is).
I believe what you have is the car version of Mobil 1, the 4T denotes the motorcycle version IIRC. On th API label does it say anything about JASO, if that is there it will work with a wet clutch, if not it's not recommended.
Having said that I'm using a Duckhams semi synth in my 2000 Girly which is definitely a car oil and so far have had no problems, not to say I wont just that I haven't.
I found this extremely interesting, the motorcycle links were informative too.
http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html (http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html)
I'm going to take the Mobil 1 15W50 back to Walmart.
I found some gallon jugs of Rotella T Synthetic at our south Walmart. The east Walmart I was at earlier today called the south store and asked them to see if they had any of the Rotella T. They said they were completely out. Ends up they were just too lazy to check. :roll:
Thanks for the help John.
I always use Motul full synth from the local bike dealer. I'd never gamble with my oil. Clutch failure in the middle of an adventure would ruin the whole break, not to mention the costs and work recovering the bike and changing the clutch!
I'm now happily running the Rotella T Synthetic with a Purolator Pure One filter that many others here (and in other forums) have expressed their confidence in.
:D
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"I found this extremely interesting, the motorcycle links were informative too.
http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html (http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html)
I was curious, so I read the oil site above. It reads like a compendium of old wives' tales, owner's manuals, and oil supplier's advice. Some good advice, some garbage, but mostly regurgitated common knowledge.
Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "John Stenhouse"I found this extremely interesting, the motorcycle links were informative too.
http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html (http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html)
I was curious, so I read the oil site above. It reads like a compendium of old wives' tales, owner's manuals, and oil supplier's advice. Some good advice, some garbage, but mostly regurgitated common knowledge.
Try this one. The data is based on actual laboratory tests...
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/ (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/)
Quote from: "Stretch"Try this one. The data is based on actual laboratory tests...
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/ (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/)
Agree. There is a huge thread on a Ducati site where Bob carefully and patiently answers hundreds of stupid questions. He clearly knows his stuff.
Quote from: "Jim S"I always use Motul full synth from the local bike dealer. I'd never gamble with my oil. Clutch failure in the middle of an adventure would ruin the whole break, not to mention the costs and work recovering the bike and changing the clutch!
Show me one solid case that can be attributed to oil of a clutch failure. With the tens of thousands of members on many the web forums, many who use Rotella or other 'car oils'. if the case was there for failure, it would show up in spades. But it does not.
I have been built many superbike motors and for the racers always recommended Delo 400 since they changed their oil after each ride. Never, not once, did I or any of my customers experience clutch failures.
If you want to buy a marketing guy a new Ferrari, go ahead an keep using motorcycle specific oils. Whatever lets you sleep at night.
BTW, Rotella passed all the JASO MA standards tests per a conversation with one of their engineers. They just chose not to pay the high fees required to put the stamp on their bottles.
Quote from: "Stretch"Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "John Stenhouse"I found this extremely interesting, the motorcycle links were informative too.
http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html (http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html)
I was curious, so I read the oil site above. It reads like a compendium of old wives' tales, owner's manuals, and oil supplier's advice. Some good advice, some garbage, but mostly regurgitated common knowledge.
Try this one. The data is based on actual laboratory tests...
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/ (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/)
Like the title says. Uncommon knowledge is refreshing in this world fueled by advertising.
I spent a bit of time as a bike mechanic and I've changed a few clutches which the owner has admitted to using car oils. Any how, here's a post elsewhere which goes into great detail why not;
http://www.bikenomads.com/wiki/index.ph ... l_in_bikes (http://www.bikenomads.com/wiki/index.php/Do_not_use_car_oil_in_bikes)
But hey, why waste your time reading info posted up by me? I've only 30yrs experience as a biker so what would I know? I'll think twice about wasting your time with useless advice in future. This was my first post for months on here and flamed for my info, ho hum! Back to the XRV forum!
Quote from: "2004Tiger"some garbage
Must have missed that bit, do tell?
Quote from: "Jim S"I spent a bit of time as a bike mechanic and I've changed a few clutches which the owner has admitted to using car oils....
Please note that nobody has advocated use of car oils on this forum. Diesel truck oil is a different thing.
Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "Jim S"I spent a bit of time as a bike mechanic and I've changed a few clutches which the owner has admitted to using car oils....
Please note that nobody has advocated use of car oils on this forum. Diesel truck oil is a different thing.
And what about Diesel car oil?
We don't seem to get Rotella in the UK. Shell may call it Helix over here but I'm reluctant to try that in case it's completely different stuff.
I have to say that I wouldn't risk a fully synth car oil because it MAY be too slippery for the clutch.
Of course, in days past, when all you could get were mineral oils it didn't seem to matter. We'd probably get away with using Semi-synth.
Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "Jim S"I spent a bit of time as a bike mechanic and I've changed a few clutches which the owner has admitted to using car oils....
Please note that nobody has advocated use of car oils on this forum. Diesel truck oil is a different thing.
Hmm, isn't that a bit like saying that Car and Motorcycle oil is different, I thought that was the original query?
Quote from: "blacktiger"Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "Jim S"I spent a bit of time as a bike mechanic and I've changed a few clutches which the owner has admitted to using car oils....
Please note that nobody has advocated use of car oils on this forum. Diesel truck oil is a different thing.
And what about Diesel car oil?
We don't seem to get Rotella in the UK. Shell may call it Helix over here but I'm reluctant to try that in case it's completely different stuff.
I have to say that I wouldn't risk a fully synth car oil because it MAY be too slippery for the clutch.
Of course, in days past, when all you could get were mineral oils it didn't seem to matter. We'd probably get away with using Semi-synth.
I don't know about diesel car oil. Is it the same as diesel truck oil? Has anyone used it in a Tiger and reported the results? I use Shell Rotella Synthetic in my diesel Dodge Cummins, after extensive reading and comparison to other oils. This research showed me that it would be good for my Tiger also, and experience to date by me and others bears this out.
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "Jim S"I spent a bit of time as a bike mechanic and I've changed a few clutches which the owner has admitted to using car oils....
Please note that nobody has advocated use of car oils on this forum. Diesel truck oil is a different thing.
Hmm, isn't that a bit like saying that Car and Motorcycle oil is different, I thought that was the original query?
Of course car and motorcycle oil is different. Some of them. Popular wisdom (and oil manufacturers) say you don't want friction modifiers in your clutch. Energy conserving car oil, usually 10-30 weight, have friction modifiers. Other weights usually don't. You are using a car oil in your Tiger, presumably with good results so far. After a while you might feel confident enough to recommend your Duckhams to other Tiger riders, under the same conditions you ride.
Similarly, I independently determined that Rotella Synthetic has the correct combination of additive package, viscosity range, and price for me to stock it and use it in both my Cummins and my Tiger. So far so good. I recommend it for riders under similar conditions of climate and road, and my opinion is reinforced by other users.
I can't recommend a car oil with friction modifier, having never used it in a Tiger, and contrary to advice of experts and users, but it's entirely possible that of the dozens available one or another is good enough.
I'm not trying to pick a fight here but, your research seems to be flawed.
Diesel truck and car oil of the same spec is identical, there are additive differences between petrol oil and diesel oil, as the site you dismissed as rubbish states.
Shell rotella isn't available in the UK so the point here is moot, as you point out it is the friction modifiers you want to avoid with a wet clutch.
I wouldn't suggest anyone to try what I have in my bike as the conditions they ride under may be very different. I did however consult the manufacturer when I put it in, they didn't recommend it for the reason it wasn't passed to JASO standards.
I found your answers kind of patronising, but as this is a non visual method of communication I may be mistaken, if I am I apologise. If not try not to talk down to those who have done similar research to your own but come to different conclusions.
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"I'm not trying to pick a fight here but, your research seems to be flawed.
I also am fighting with nobody, or even argueing. I am stating my position and my results. Please point out the flaws you have discovered, perhaps I can restate more clearly, or agree with you.
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"Diesel truck and car oil of the same spec is identical, there are additive differences between petrol oil and diesel oil, as the site you dismissed as rubbish states.
Please reread my statement. I said "some garbage" not total rubbish. In general that site is good, if common, information. As discussed, bobistheoilguy.com is much more informative.
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"Shell rotella isn't available in the UK so the point here is moot, as you point out it is the friction modifiers you want to avoid with a wet clutch. I wouldn't suggest anyone to try what I have in my bike as the conditions they ride under may be very different. I did however consult the manufacturer when I put it in, they didn't recommend it for the reason it wasn't passed to JASO standards.
But you might suggest, after you gain some confidence in the oil, that those who ride under similar conditions will have similar results. I have done that.
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"I found your answers kind of patronising, but as this is a non visual method of communication I may be mistaken, if I am I apologise. If not try not to talk down to those who have done similar research to your own but come to different conclusions.
I may deserve to have my hand slapped. I am a rider and wrencher for 47 years, and a degreed and Registered mechanical engineer of 38 years. I have an intense background in lubricants, adhesives, metallurgy, and machine design. I have studied and rebuilt engines from exotic to ordinary. I am confident in my statements, and too pedantic at times. My conclusions are specific to my circumstances and anyone else must modify them to suit, another's similar research is not expected to match my conclusions (unless they use my data) and I don't see where I devalued any. Lacking background, the general public does well to follow the advice of oil and machinery manufacturers. When I choose not to with good results, am I wrong? Are they wrong? Their advice is for their product usage in general, my choices are for my machine, my climate, my roads in particular, and I'm qualified to do so.
:shock:
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Calm down Mustang I'm not about to explode :lol:
2004 Tiger, Peace brother, I'm not saying your wrong, I can't, I'm not qualified and it ain't my place to do so!
I said you came across as rather patronising, your answer looked from my point of view as;
Your wrong, the site you've provided is rubbish, these are my answers and they're all you need to know!
And that kind of got my back up when you then stated you'd done extensive research but didn't seem to know wether truck oil and car oil were the same.
I guess it's the way you type :lol: No hard feelings
Quote from: "John Stenhouse"Calm down Mustang I'm not about to explode :lol:
hehehe
just trying to lighten the mood oil threads seem to always turn nasty , me I just like to make sure that the level stays full of whatever brand x, y or z that's in it and is changed once in a while ! :ImaPoser
You have to be careful online, since you can't see the person your "talking to", it's very easy to take something the wrong way without it ever having meant to be!
Should have learnt my lesson after a 2CV forum member flounced off in a huff after someone posted the most innocuous comment and I put a smiley after it! OOPS! :lol:
I have read oil war threads with grin and chagrin, and usually manage to keep my mouth shut. Comparatively, this was merely a skirmish, but I apologise for my behavior, to John and any reader who was offended.
Quote from: "Mustang"...I just like to make sure that the level stays full of whatever brand x, y or z that's in it and is changed once in a while !
Agreed. Beyond this sensible but oft ignored axiom, most argument amounts to nitpicking.
Quote from: "2004Tiger"Quote from: "Mustang"...I just like to make sure that the level stays full of whatever brand x, y or z that's in it and is changed once in a while !
Agreed. Beyond this sensible but oft ignored axiom, most argument amounts to nitpicking.
So true, perhaps whenever there is an oil thread come up, we should just post this and leave it at that.
I also apologise for my over sensitivity! Peace brothers, we can agree on one thing, we all love Tigers 8)
Woe is me for ever starting this thread. Can I point out here that I'm still really enjoying the Tiger?
Ride on. :grnb
I have to go potty!
Quote from: "TigerTrax"I have to go potty!
We will excuse you :lol: