Hello everyone, my name is Titus, and I have recently (2 months) bought a Steamer for my wife and I to go cruising in comfort long story short, after a full carb rebuild gaskets and orings balanced and all the good stuff, our "little" friend started acting up.
First fit was tach boncing a little on decel
Second was a huge backfire and a total loss of engine and tach as if you pushed the killswitch, started right up and went on our way.
Third was another huge backfire, the day after and we had to wait a couple of smokes to get it running.
Fourth was me getting home from work and it barely running, opening the throttle was like hitting the redline just boncing there at 1500 rpm.
Today she only idle's for 10seconds and then dies, next attempt she idles for 5, then 3 sec. In this orded and at these intervals, I swear, to get it to idle 10 secs you have to wait 10 minutes.
Little fu.ker is ordered new, replacement cdi on the way from the uk...
Checked the little fu.ker, seems ok, ac voltage and ohms, still changed it with a japanese model with different ohms and she does the SAME THING!
Checked all conections, ok, cdi has a leaky transistor...whatever should work on 2 cyl even if it was dead, will change transistor on monday.
Found that the alternator wires were melted and fried in their connector, big white thing hidden besides the rear shock, cut wires, removed alty and sent for refurbishment, even with alt removed she does the SAME THING! On the two alty wires I have 12v with key off and 0 with key on is that normal?
I also have a ghost relay under the seat next two batt, no idea what it does, clicks with key on, bike runs all electrics with or without it.
Please fellow Steamer guardians help us bring our lovely bike back to life, will post photos and everything needed, as you can see I am trying my best, bought all the parts just waiting for them to arrive.
Short: Starts, runs 10 seconds dies, next start 5 sec, last start 3 sec. Not accepting any throttle. Wait 10 minutes, then repeat, you can actually time it.
Ghost relay has something to do with the bike being in neutral and the sidestand, volts coming and going, problem is with the bike in gear and sidestand down I get 8v there, battery is on charger btw. How can I bypass/eliminate that thing? Maybe it's cutting down on volt supply to the cdi.
Hey Titus
Steamers were known for bad coils, but not that many cdi failures. If the Alternator R/R failed it may have cooked the CDI unit.
Maybe post a pic of the ghost relay.
Thought about coils but refuse to believe that all 3 die at the same time and interval, remember runs 10 s then dies. Starts when shown the key so not a fueling problem, alty had wires welded, sent for repair, cdi is on the way hope to get it soon. Ghost relay is under seat 4 prong, relates to key on, neutral light and sidestand whatever you do or bridge the relay bike runs 10s then stops. However when sidestand down we get some 8v to the relay, sidestand switch does its job so cant be related. Ordered cdi from ebay today, some seller from uk, hope it gets to romania soon.
I will try anything you guys suggest, going out of my mind here. Bike is cursed, I swear.
Posted clip to youtube with its gremlin
Gday Titus,
I have had a bad coil pickup/crank sensor (seems to live by many names!). The time frame was a lot longer, but when the bike warmed, the unit failed. Cooled down, ran again. Drove me nuts, but I was given the solution on this forum. Might be worth a look if you have no luck with your current adventures.
Regards, Bern.
Thank you Beernard, pickup is on the way brand new from Britishlegends france, brand new, of course I've read through the forum and also blamed the pickup, thats why I have it new on the way, changed it with another type with totally different values and bike did the same, we'll see when it arrives.
Found out that white alt wire goes to a connector under the dash and to the ign switch, and little brown one to the same conector, ign off we have 12 to the wires, ign on we have 0.
Question, what does the alternator put out of these two wires fat white and little brown which were browned out and welded together and why do they go to the ign switch? Is the cdi getting a alt running signal? AC, DC?
You can download the full service manual from the site, I think..
Tried just now, seems to be unavailible for the steamer, just find the model based on vin number, nothing more :icon_frown:
PM'd you.
Thank you Phil, responded.
Sorry Titus, I can't add to the discussion from here. All the best.
We will get to the bottom of it, I bet the melted alternator wires had a big role here, maybe even cooked the cdi, will keep you guys posted, next week I have the alt back and the pickup.
Thank you everyone!!!
Quote from: Titus on April 14, 2024, 02:43:03 PMWe will get to the bottom of it, I bet the melted alternator wires had a big role here, maybe even cooked the cdi, will keep you guys posted, next week I have the alt back and the pickup.
Thank you everyone!!!
Manual is on the Steamers Facebook page. https://www.facebook.com/groups/824051841083961/files/files. You may find more info over there. There are some instances of Alternator connectors melting from high resistance.
Alternator has 2 wires, fat white one and little brown one, white one has 12v when ign off, voltage drops when ign on, brown one has 12v all the time, measured against the big mass screwed between the alternator and engine block, is that normal? What is the alt supposed to output? Have the manual and wiring diagram, just cant figure it out. Is the bike supposed to run without the alt? If you see my video, sure looks like a volt supply problem, hope to get the alt back tomorrow.
Fat white goes direct to battery via a fuse. Brown one goes to the switched live circuits, so yes one is live at all times. Alternator outputs the dc charging voltage, as it contains all the charging components, ie stator and rectifier/regulator system.
Bike should run without the alternator.
BUT ...DO NOT USE THE STARTER WITH A WEAK BATTERY....YOU WILL DESTROY THE STARTER SPRAG CLUTCH.
Just don't do it. Unless you have a very early engine with an access cover, you run the risk of a serious repair.
Never did it Phil, always backed up by car battery, thanks for the head up, well if it should run it doesnt, just behaves like in the video.
My tiger has the fat white running up the main harness, no connection to the battery, called it up and goes to a con block then to the ign switch. So...same as in the wiring diagram.
Behaves like the cdi runs out of juice to feed the coils, doesn't look the same to you? Starts the runs progressively less. Already checked all connections so I'm out, pickup coil arrived today, will change it after I fit the alternator and check how it goes. If both these parts dont fix her, we will have to wait for the cdi to get here (hoping it's a good one). Guess it's time to start throwing parts at her until she wakes up.
Wish me luck.Screenshot_2024-04-14-23-16-33-983_com.google.android.apps.docs.jpg
Nothing worked, alternator charging fine, also fixed DAR, fitted brand new pickup coil, no difference, bike starts then stops, sometimes no spark at all.
I'm out of ideas, cdi is on the way but ebay estimates 30'th this month, and of course its a second hand part, who knows if it works...
Anyone have a spare, working cdi?
WHAT ELSE CAN I CHECK?!?!
Leftfield, but how's the petrol flow?, the tank filter can collapse and starve the bike, as well as a tiny filter in the Tee near the carbs.
Petrol flow not relevant, it's being fed by a cup, no filter, no tee in the carb (just rebuilt them).
Even tried running it on starter fluid, no difference, also thought about fueling but still...ruled it out with the starter fluid.
Also float bowls full of gas, plugs full of gas.
Ghost relay is the sidestand/neutral switch thingy, bridged it.
Could all three coils leave the chat at once and cause such madness?
Think a swap of the cdi is the next place to go...
Unplugged everything not related to the starting/ignition - same.
Does it have another fuse besides the main one in the "trunk" the rest are labeled horn/head/stuff like that.
Only place I havent checked for good contact is the start stop switch...could it be? Afraid of springs flying everywhere.
Cdi...yes on the way, but what if its a dud?
Most T400 cdi units will work, they just have different rev limits and some minor timing differences.
Germany has many, as it was very popular over there.
This is probably the best value
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/364311056219
And regarding the fuses, the connectors can become bad, both the main connector for loom to fuse box, and under the fuses themselves.
It's been a few years since I had my Steamer, so I'm struggling to remember, but I don't think there are any other fuses.
The cdi I bought was 48 gbp :rfl
So yeah, we'll see, I'll check all of the fuses just in case, reconect the battery just in case and take apart the start stop, maybe a hot wire loses conection, maybe...
Quote from: Titus on April 16, 2024, 05:43:40 PMThe cdi I bought was 48 gbp :rfl
So yeah, we'll see, I'll check all of the fuses just in case, reconect the battery just in case and take apart the start stop, maybe a hot wire loses conection, maybe...
Good price...
Just hope it's not broken
Looking back over the forum, there is some evidence that the ecu transistors can fail on the T400, so hopefully the repair will work. Luckily they are not totally SMD boards. I did have one in bits years ago, but unlikely to have the photos anymore..
Well, that would be something, they are tip 152, one of them had leaked (coil 1 driver) but my electronist said its no problem. Ok will change all 3 tomorrow and see what happens.
If you dont let the engine start (wot) you get constant spark, soon as she fires and sparks have to be faster they (sparks) just fade away.
Of course it's a power delivery issue from the ecu, has to be.
Nothing works, booked a mechanic for friday, hope he can figure something out, she runs on starting fluid though but if you try to accelerate something bangs inside.
Will it run with the choke out?
Anything above idle, chocke included makes it instantly die. Made it idle for about a minute using starting fluid before the air filter through the removable cap. Rattled like someone dropped a hammer in the engine when I tried to touch the gas, then I stopped.
Maybe it's fueling after all sometimes flooding, sometimes leaning, I sincerely am beat by the steamer.
I got a mechanic for friday, if he can't come, I'll pull the carbs and see if I can find anything.
Update, CDI arrived, bike runs perfect. Lesson learned, although we measured everything, changes transistors, resoldered and all the good stuff, only thing that made it run was another cdi, arrived today and she purrs and revs like the beast she is.
She is in pieces but will put her back together tomorrow.
Yessss. Nice result.
You are now the new official expert on Steamer CDi's lol...
I will kill the old one with a hammer, hopefully it will get me closure.
Thank you everyone, this forum is a great place.
Will be active and help however I can !
Done, celebrated labor day by working on her. Rebuilt carbs and put her back together, she was a parts pile.
Still need a digital clock because the p.o. thought a fake temp gauge from an old vw was cooler and lost the original clock...
She is soooo pretty !!! :love10 [attach id=19291]IMG_20240501_230240.jpg
And a 124 E Class behind on original alloys too.... 2 fine looking vehicles...
And a honda xr 500 from 1985 next to the 124, and a volvo 480 wedge on the right hidden behind the tiger. We love our old stuff. 124 is a 2.8 from 93, same birthday as the tiger.
Still amazing how that cdi fooled us, damned thing.
Glad it happened, weather was crap anyway and had do the alternator rattle anyway plus every leccy contact on the bike is clean and shiny and the little f..ker is also brand new.
Most importantly made some friends abroad and found a great forum :occasion14
Went for a short ride today, everything is ok, no more alternator rattle, bike pulls like a banshee and idles like brand new.
Question, where do you set your idle rpms? Found that 1000 is the number but seems a little low, I set it to about 1200 and seems to pull away crisper, what are your thoughts on that?
Searched ebay for a clock, lowest one I found was 100 euros...jeez, waiting for a better priced one.
I seem to recall about 1100rpm worked for me.
Re the clock
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/256208272397 is cheapest I can see
Oh my, thank you !!!
Put it on favourites, I usually get a 10% discount in a few hours and will buy it.
Great find, thank you !!!!
Or stick a Voltmeter in its place, and put a generic clock somewhere..
I like it looking stock and original, seen a voltmeter fitting made to fit the windshield bolt on the forum, no cutting just a bracket. Will copy that.
Got the clock, right after I saved the one you sent me got a sugestion with one from germany for 47 euros, faved it and grabbed it for 45.
Sadly since brexit anything from the uk carries a heavy 15 pound min tax alongside a really expensive transport fee.
Anyway, clock is on the way, thank you Phill!
Nice work Titus.
My recollection is that the great Mustang said he loved 1200 idle. I do too.
Bummer that your CDI played games. My original just shat itself instantly, about 100k from home. Had to hide her in the bush and come back to collect the next day. Looks like you are doing a great job with this bike. Well done.
Thank you for the kind words Beernard, I'm doing my best. Still afraid of the cdi, should I get another one just in case? Maybe in a few years they will stop being availible. You can fix anything mechanical and fabricate stuff but that little bugger...
Further questions.
1.Temp gauge seems to not show anything above the second cold line, thermostat and fan switch are fine, getting up to about 95c then fan kicks in, no problem. Cleaned electrical conection, same, cleaned temp sensor, same, what to change? Temp sensor or gauge? Barely gets above the cold mark even if engine hot fan running.
2. I have a little conection small nipple in the airbox to the rear of the bike, its drawing in unfiltered air as it is after the air filter, small 8mm dia. nipple, what should that connect to? Should I blank it off ? Only airbox connection in the manual is the crankcase vent, is this little nipple a drain? It draws unfiltered air so a little worried.
I'm sure the Airbox drain should have a bung in it, and the temp gauge sounds about right.
You can always try connecting it to some resistances.
Yes it's a drain, found it in a parts manual, and it should have a cap/plug, will fit something there.
Temp gauge goes to max if earthing it, so that is normal, just weird that it always stays so low, only if warmed up after a ride and left to idle the needle barely moves. Seen some youtube vids, some seem to be doing the same thing, others work just fine.
Bike is running perfect and I'm here bothered by a little temp gauge :rfl
Also, how do you make both headlamps turn on with the lowbeam? Only highbeam makes them both light up.
Hey Titus,
Good work in sorting out the CDI issue.
My '93 (with painted side cases) has always had both headlights on High & Low beam.
I seem to recall this was an issue with later 955i 'bikes, which needed an extra Relay to have both on?
Have a good look at the wiring diagram, or have a look for 'empty' relay socket?
Regards,
Bill
I found nothing, only the relay for the highbeam, I have left headlamp on with low and both on with high, bike is made for german market I guess, lots of factory stickers under seat in german.
Both are h4's but the highbeam one has only 2 wires, one for 12v comes from high relay and one for ground. If I monkey a wire from the left lamp to the right they both light up and work as you want but it strains the alternator alot, you can hear it, also dimms heavily on idle, so not good.
I'm sure there is a way to do it properly.
UK version had both on, I'm sure..
Manual states 2 relays, wiring diagram has them, bike doesnt...
Just have the one relay which sends power to the right bulb when high is pressed. Right bulb socket only has two wires, so never meant to have low beam there, bulbs are both h4.
Found a relay kit from sprintmanufacturing which they say fix the problem...they are just two car relays, no extra wires no nothing, so doesnt fix anything.
Original UK bikes had only one headlight on low & one off from the factory. My 06 Tiger was like this when I bought it. Something to do with car drivers seeing two lights & not being able to tell if it was a car a long way away or a bike close up. All UK bikes, not just Triumphs were at one point the same.
I bought an extra relay from ebay & plugged it in to the empty plug on the left under the nose cone so I could have both lights on dip.
Can't rember if only 1 or 2 main beam lights came on originally but they do now.
The steamer has both on for highbeam, problem is on my bike there isnt anything to plug the second relay into, it's just wired that way, only thing I can do is redo the wiring to add a plug for a second relay.
Bummer, I like to keep stuff original but hate the one eye look...
They are literally duplicated relays driving both dipped, the same as the mains.
Bit of wiring and your done..
On eBay UK..
Yes Phil, my thougts exacly, the manual has very a clear wiring diagram, will copy it, I think my clock arrives on monday/tuesday, fairings need to come off anyway so will do it !
Any thoughts on crash bars? Heed makes them and are availible, dont really like the look of them.
Big Blue is working with me !
Quote from: Titus on May 10, 2024, 10:07:55 AMYes Phil, my thougts exacly, the manual has very a clear wiring diagram, will copy it, I think my clock arrives on monday/tuesday, fairings need to come off anyway so will do it !
Any thoughts on crash bars? Heed makes them and are availible, dont really like the look of them.
I had Thunderbike crash bars on mine. They were very solid..
Can't find them anywhere, only in photos on google, they look great.
I fitted Hepco & Becker 'Bars to my '93 as soon as I bought it in '99, Personal import from Germany.
They've saved damage from (too) numerous zero-speed drops, with barely a scratch.
At 5 points a drop, I must have accumulated thousands.......
Bill
Wow, HB's look great Bill, only problem I have with them is the price tag, 285 euros on their site, must have been a fortune back when the bike was relatively new. Thanks!
Titus,
The cost of the H&B's much less than potential damage to bars/panels/tank on the Steamer - or any 'bike for that matter. They are asymmetrical, but difficult to see, covers the remote for the rear shock.
Recommended.
Bill
Previous owner drilled a big hole in the left fairing, fitted a nice voltmeter and usb charger hooked up to a open connector in the wiring loom which has 12v switched.
By tomorrow I should have the clock and she will be complete.
Is the 320 kph speedo normal? Or maybe it's borrowed from a sprint or other triumph? Mine was made for the german market.
Jeez! You'd have to hang on tight at 320 kph!!
Mine maxes out at 220 kph. Looks like yours is off a Daytona?
Bill
Very ambitious of them, went 160 kph max, felt very unsafe, maybe it's from a Daytona, p.o. did some weird stuff to it now it's my job to restore it to factory condition.
Also got some bags from Louis which are easy to instal just remove the seat and hang them there.
Don't need them around town and to work, will only use them when we go about and need some clothes.