My 2005 Tiger has been overheating over the last few months. Before I had the issue, the radiator had a leak and I had it repaired at a local shop. Shortly after that, the bike overheated on my commute home from work. It got hot and started pissing coolant from the reservoir on the dash. I researched the issue and ordered a new radiator cap, since most posts said it was the main culprit.
The bike worked fine for about a week, then randomly overheated the same way. This time, I propped the tank up and tried my best to bleed the system of air. I ran it in my driveway for about 40 minutes, cracking open the bleed port randomly as it warmed up.
The bike has gone through about three tanks of gas, maybe 600 miles. Today on a nice back country ride it overheated again. Nothing unusual, just riding it and it got hot and started pissing coolant all over my jacket and helmet. It got just into the red. I shut it down for about ten minutes. Since I was about 25 miles from home I started it again and started riding it home. I got almost up to the red, and twice went into the red but didn't feel hot. It pissed coolant two more times. When I got it home, it dumped some out from the overflow.
I added some coolant to the overflow tank, and let it idle. It never got into the red, but got hotter than usual.
Recap: Bike overheats. I have changed the cap and bled the system of air. It works fine for a while, then out of the blue it overheats and blows coolant from the overflow tank. What's my next step? Thermostat?
Although I don't know whether the conditions for a random boil up were the same as conditions where the fan is needed, I'd check the fan is working first. After that change the thermostat. And find out how your rad was "fixed". Was it fixed because of stone damage or was it rotten? It could be it's partially blocked, but do the easy stuff first.
All of the above and if you re-filled the coolant in under 15 minutes ie put some in let it settle etc than it was too quick I have never had to bleed mine.
same as above, however where is your coolant level at cold. I keep mine at the lower mark
Check that the hoses to the overflow tank are not reversed. Does it pull coolant out of the reservoir when it cools down? If it is pissing coolant it should end up on the ground by the back tire not up by the tank. Possibly a pinched hose for the overflow
I suppose the best idea would be to get a new radiator. Ouch they are expensive! The repair guy said it was getting thin, so it may be rotted a bit and getting plugged? Always go to the last thing that failed and work from there.
My bike has 80,000+ miles so I can understand the radiator getting a bit flimsy. The fan is working fine, comes on as the bike gets past halfway on the temp gauge. The hoses to the overflow are routed correct and I blew threw them to make sure they aren't clogged. I will double check to make sure they aren't kinked.
I found a used radiator on Ebay, it's from a 99 Tiger. Does anyone know if they are the same for the 2005?
If the thing is pissing coolant from around the overflow tank something is either hooked up wrong or a drain hose is pinched or plugged. Replacing the radiator will not fix that problem.
I will double check the drain lines. It also was pissing coolant from the overflow behind the engine, so that line is clear. I will pull the fairing off today and re-check everything.
I just find it odd that it is intermittent. It works fine for a few days or weeks, then happens randomly. I rode it to work today and it ran cool all the way until traffic outside the base, where it got to about half on the gauge and the fan came on. Didn't leak coolant anywhere and the overflow tank is half full.
Quote from: NortonCharlie on March 31, 2014, 06:32:17 PM
If the thing is pissing coolant from around the overflow tank something is either hooked up wrong or a drain hose is pinched or plugged. Replacing the radiator will not fix that problem.
what about the thermostat, is that knackered. simple to check once you have remove the thermostat from the bike.
do you have automotive radiator specialists near you, if you think its the Radiator before you splash the cash it might be worth them having a look.
This is one a few miles from home, too far for you but this is the type of place I mean.
http://www.rickettsradiators.co.uk/Radiators.html
I haven't tested the thermostat yet, might be next on the list. The place that repaired my radiator does all the stuff like the place in your link. He said it's getting thin and because of that was difficult to repair. It probably needs to be replaced, but not sure if it's causing my issues.
Quote from: daveb on March 31, 2014, 09:14:42 PM
what about the thermostat, is that knackered. simple to check once you have remove the thermostat from the bike.
do you have automotive radiator specialists near you, if you think its the Radiator before you splash the cash it might be worth them having a look.
This is one a few miles from home, too far for you but this is the type of place I mean.
http://www.rickettsradiators.co.uk/Radiators.html
Just got home from work. It was running fine, temp gauge was on the lower 1/3 of the gauge until about a mile from home. Then it slowly climbed up to just below the red and started spitting coolant from the dash area and a bit of steam. I could see coolant bubbling into the overflow tank. I got it home, it was still on the high side of the gauge and coolant was coming out of the overflow behind the engine and some steam from the dash area. Coolant on the right side of the tank as well.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7061/13546336413_b6e1c978d4.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mD3vSn)
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7437/13546247295_0bc4bde2d9.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mD34nR)
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3713/13546567264_f2c343c9b6.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mD4Guy)
So since I was experiencing the issue at home, I kept it running and started to pull the fairing off. This is what I found.
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3724/13546570194_9072ba684e.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mD4Hn5)
The upper hose fitting is cracked. This is where the steam and water appears to be coming from. I guess I'll order one up and see what happens.
Remember, easy stuff first. Sort that out, then check the thermostat, it's the next cheapest thing. Don't blow money on a rad till you have to.
I checked the routing of the hose from the thermostat housing to the overflow tank. It may have been slightly pinched, not sure.
I'm going to try to find an elbow at Home Depot to replace the cracked one.
That cracked fitting could cause all of your symptoms. Fluid would run to the tank when expanded then suck air when it cools and tries to replenish the tank. This gives you bigger air bubbles in the tank, less efficient cooling, thermostats get flukey when they are not submerged. Your coolant system turns into a balloon then when it gets hot it blows a lot of air instead of a little coolant. I know a few have gone to the hardware store to source an elbow that will work. I do believe you have found the culprit.
I incorrectly said it was the upper hose fitting that was cracked. It's the lower one, which is the one going to the overflow hose that is cracked.
So I found out that a brass fitting will fit. Got one at the local Home Depot for less than $2
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7110/13552821474_26bb95f4c6.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mDBKDL)
Fits just fine.
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2906/13552494595_c8ac00b1c8.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mDA5tV)
Now, hopefully it won't be spewing coolant on the dash anymore. But if it does continue to overheat, I'll look into the thermostat next.
Which brings us full circle because some time back Metalguru did a thread on such a brass fitting and we cannot such in the Uk,he got his from Canada.
I knew when we were in Carlsbad in January there was something I mean't to buy and just couldn't remember bit of a hike to go back!!
Ok, so the bike has been acting up a bit over the last week or so. It stays cool for a day or two, then on the way home from work it will creep toward the red and maybe put out a bit of coolant or steam from the overflow, which works good now that I have the brass elbow. Anyway, I was on a back country ride today and it crept toward the hot side about 50 miles into the ride. It stayed down below the red, but just a bit below. The engine never felt hot, and it would even cool down a bit when I stopped and let it idle and then crept towards the hot side as I got back on the road.
Stopped for lunch, let it cool down. On the way home, it started to get hot again, and then pushed into the red. I pulled off the highway and steam was coming out from under the tank. I kept the bike idling and it cooled off to below the middle of the temp gauge. I was less than ten miles from home, so decided to try to get home.
It would heat up to just below the red, spewing steam from under the tank and then it would cool down and quit steaming everywhere. Made it home just fine and pulled the tank off after it cooled off.
Here's what I found. Hole in the thermostat housing, and the rest of it was not in good shape either.
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3755/13655568364_068d09e738.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNGmHS)
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2810/13655252413_673a5a47f3.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNEJNr)
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2902/13655576314_640fc725f9.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNGp5W)
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2938/13655581374_4d09ce5f89.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNGqAb)
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7108/13655236155_b386217058.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNEDY8)
The thermostat shouldn't look like that, pretty sure?!
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3753/13655271433_239200c2c5.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNEQsn)
Never had this apart before, but I believe this is supposed to be a guide for the thermostat. It's all messed up inside.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7115/13655245985_5d87a0a338.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNEGTB)
Also found this piece of metal in the thermostat housing. WTF?
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3765/13655251055_6e940e99ff.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/mNEJp2)
well on the plus side you at least found the problem ...........
I'm hoping this is what has been causing the overheating issues. Maybe the thermostat has been getting jammed up in there?
Anyway, I got lucky and snagged a thermostat housing on Ebay for $45 shipped. Hoping for the best.
Don't want to be the dour Scot again but I'd suggest having a look inside your water pump and a good flush with decent pressure hose in the reverse flow direction.
For sure, that is planned before running this thing up again.
Quote from: Sin_Tiger on April 06, 2014, 10:46:31 AM
Don't want to be the dour Scot again but I'd suggest having a look inside your water pump and a good flush with decent pressure hose in the reverse flow direction.
Giffard you found it though :thumbsup
Changed out the thermostat housing and thermostat with used parts I got from Ebay. Bled the system out fairly well, at least I think so. Last night I got it all finished up and took the Tiger out for a ride, did about 25 miles and it stayed nice and cool. I figured my issues were behind me.
This morning I got started on a ride out to the mountains. It was doing just fine until about 15 miles into the ride where it spiked up to just below the red and started bubbling out of the overflow tank all over the side of the tank, the dash and it was blowing out the hose in front of the rear tire. I pulled over and let it cool off a bit, wiped everything up.
On the way home, it would quickly heat up to about 3/4 on the gauge and steam was coming from the overflow tank. When I would stop for a bit, I could hear it bubbling in the overflow. It would get hotter on the highway, cool down at stop lights a bit and heat up as I would go faster.
So now I'm back to square one. It runs cool on one ride, then gets hot on the next. Runs hot on the highway, but stays cooler in town. I just don't know...
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3810/13806143123_a3338a2b20.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/n316mp)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/n316mp) by tntmo2 (https://www.flickr.com/people/77815129@N04/), on Flickr
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3757/13806122075_dbc9d95b62.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/n2ZZ6v)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/n2ZZ6v) by tntmo2 (https://www.flickr.com/people/77815129@N04/), on Flickr
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3817/13806125755_a3951250eb.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/n311bX)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/n311bX) by tntmo2 (https://www.flickr.com/people/77815129@N04/), on Flickr
If you are sure you bled it properly and had no air pockets, I'd be looking closely at the water pump again. Is the drive to the impeller ok? It sounds like the pump isn't working all the time. I know that's a long shot, but when you eliminate the likely, you have to deal with what's left. I think Sherlock Homes said that.
The imtermittent feature of this fault is leaning me away from head gasket at this stage, but a compression check wouldn't do any harm.
Edit: just read your post again, are you sure the Ebay stat is working properly? A new one isn't that expensive......
I am going to try to bleed the system again and see what happens.
I pulled the water pump cover to check that out, I didn't see anything unusual.
Thermostat would be my first thought as well, just find it funny that it's acting the same as before.
Would head gasket be intermittent like this? I'd think it would be all the time.
Quote from: Bixxer Bob on April 13, 2014, 09:04:09 AM
If you are sure you bled it properly and had no air pockets, I'd be looking closely at the water pump again. Is the drive to the impeller ok? It sounds like the pump isn't working all the time. I know that's a long shot, but when you eliminate the likely, you have to deal with what's left. I think Sherlock Homes said that.
The imtermittent feature of this fault is leaning me away from head gasket at this stage, but a compression check wouldn't do any harm.
Edit: just read your post again, are you sure the Ebay stat is working properly? A new one isn't that expensive......
I don't think head gasket would be intermittent, hence me saying I'm leaning away from that for now, but at the same time if it's not the obvious.......
Stats sometimes get lazy and are slow to open, but it still sounds as though yours is sticking, or the pump is. I thought the stuff you found in yours worrying and it could be another piece of junk has made its way round to the stat or pump. You'll know when you strip it. And I'd still like to know what it was originally, or where it came from.....
Test the stat in a pan of cold water then heat the water up. The stat shoukd open at the temp stamped on it.
Ah, yes...I see you said that earlier about the head gasket. At this point, I'd love to just know what it is so I can get it repaired and enjoy my Tiger!
Well, I pulled the tank off and checked it all out again. Pulled the radiator and ran a bit of water through it, seems to be flowing well. Here's what the repair looks like, not pretty but don't think that should cause these issues.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7359/13828200594_d3903dbf1a.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/n4X9gC)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/n4X9gC) by tntmo2 (https://www.flickr.com/people/77815129@N04/), on Flickr
I pulled the water pump out, everything looks ok there. I removed it completely, the drive spline on the back is fine and is engaging into the engine.
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2850/13827858603_ba52f16a6a.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/n4VoBe)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/n4VoBe) by tntmo2 (https://www.flickr.com/people/77815129@N04/), on Flickr
Then I pulled the radiator cap and found this again. The thermostat housing is getting messed up! This was a used Ebay part, but was in nice shape when I installed it. Now, is the thermostat failing and causing this to break down, or is this from something else?
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3725/13827865053_2be7a5b2ec.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/n4Vqwr)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/n4Vqwr) by tntmo2 (https://www.flickr.com/people/77815129@N04/), on Flickr
Quote from: Bixxer Bob on April 13, 2014, 06:06:34 PM
I don't think head gasket would be intermittent, hence me saying I'm leaning away from that for now, but at the same time if it's not the obvious.......
Stats sometimes get lazy and are slow to open, but it still sounds as though yours is sticking, or the pump is. I thought the stuff you found in yours worrying and it could be another piece of junk has made its way round to the stat or pump. You'll know when you strip it. And I'd still like to know what it was originally, or where it came from.....
Test the stat in a pan of cold water then heat the water up. The stat shoukd open at the temp stamped on it.
Is the engine oil clear?
I can follow Chris's thinking, that looks oily. Is it oily?
Also, was that lip broken when you fitted it or has it just happened?
That is old corrosion mate, been sitting unused I guess. New corrosion errosion would be quite bright. Send it back as "not as described" and get your money back.
No, the lip under the radiator cap looked brand new when I installed it on Friday. The oil appears to be fine. There was some blackish crap in the coolant, but I imagine it's from the plastic that is deteriorating from the thermostat housing.
I flushed the entire system. I guess I'll order another thermostat housing and get a thermostat. What else can I do? Radiator?
Quote from: Bixxer Bob on March 31, 2014, 10:00:03 AM
Although I don't know whether the conditions for a random boil up were the same as conditions where the fan is needed, I'd check the fan is working first. After that change the thermostat. And find out how your rad was "fixed". Was it fixed because of stone damage or was it rotten? It could be it's partially blocked, but do the easy stuff first.
I would start with replacing the radiator.
If the engine oil is good I'd try running the bike without the stat in having been to your neck of woods recently you won't need one anyway and regardless I'd have put a new stat in anyway,if it's still the same without the stat or with a new one in it has too be the rad.
:iagree
Fortunately I've found that the thermostat housing is common among a few Triumph models so I can find a few of them on the used market. I'll test the thermostat I have just for kicks, but will get a new one.
The radiator will be expensive, only a couple around in the used market and a new one is $500+. If I knew for sure it solves my overheating it would be no problem!
:iagree a also, give it a run without the stat, eliminate one thing at a time. The black stuff is aluminium oxide.
Quote from: Chris Canning on April 13, 2014, 10:34:11 PM
Is the engine oil clear?
Engine oil is clear
Quote from: Bixxer Bob on March 31, 2014, 10:00:03 AM
After that change the thermostat. And find out how your rad was "fixed". Was it fixed because of stone damage or was it rotten? It could be it's partially blocked, but do the easy stuff first.
The radiator developed a leak. The repair shop said it was difficult to repair because it was getting thin/old....which leads me to believe it could be rotten. I have run water through it from the garage tap. I can feel the opposite side getting hot or cold depending on the water temp I run through it.
I tested both of the used thermostats I have on the kitchen stove tonight. Both extended at about 190 degrees water.
Last thing: Am I ok running regular green coolant in this bike, or do I need some fancy Euro-spec stuff? Hopefully this isn't the reason all of this is happening.....
Providing it has the alloy corrosion inhibitors you'll be fine, just about anything off the shelf will do.
Everything is pointing to the rad,I see there's a couple on ebay and they are in the States and look very clean.
Quote from: Chris Canning on April 15, 2014, 09:41:06 AM
Everything is pointing to the rad,I see there's a couple on ebay and they are in the States and look very clean.
I did some reading on clogged radiators online. It seems that an indicator that you may have a clogged radiator is that it overheats at speed, but not at idle....which is how this bike is acting. This most recent event, when it got hot I tried to drive it home and it got worse on the highway, and cooled off driving around on city street.
Looks like I'll spend the money on a radiator.
Possibly head gasket? Found this account on another site, seems like exactly what's going on for me.
http://www.triumphtorque.com/messageboard/thread/144967-Would-a-blown-head-gasket-reduce-performance-noticeably.aspx
Read that link, wasn't the cause a plugged radiator, 2nd to last or so comment. Fixed it with a couple cans of Coke.
Quote from: NortonCharlie on April 16, 2014, 07:54:30 PM
Read that link, wasn't the cause a plugged radiator, 2nd to last or so comment. Fixed it with a couple cans of Coke.
No, said a few days later his bike blew coolant out the exhaust.
I see now, Any chance you could borrow a coolant system pump? I've got one but need to get adapters for the smaller neck. Great trouble shooting tool. A head gasket usually make s the pressure jump ail over the place. Or just pumping up the system without it running is a great way to check for leeks.
Good luck
I ordered all the stuff to do the head gasket.
The radiator seems to flow well when I hook it up to the garage sink, but will probably do a vinegar soak on it just to make sure.
did you get a tube of hylomar to reseal the cylinder liner bases ?
you WILL need it .
Head gasket replaced, flushed out the radiator with vinegar a few times, everything is back in one piece and 30 mile test ride is good. Now I have to keep riding it and see. The last few times it ran fine at first also, so I am not ready to trust this bike.
I'm up to 160 miles on the bike, working well so far.
Fingers crossed :augie I know it's a pain but I recommend you retorque the head before doping much more than 500 miles.
:iagree
So, when you suggest to re-torque the heads.....does that mean to break the bolts loose and then do the three sequence torque again?
That is a PITA, but if there is something out there that says that doing it will be helpful, I guess it's in my best interest.
just verify the torque at 500 miles especially since your bike has already required a head gasket job .
don't loosen them
if the torque is still at spec leave em' be
before you put the head back on ,you did reseal the cylinder bases with hylomar sealant , right ?
How would you verify the torque, when the procedure is to torque them in two stages, then turn them 90 degrees beyond that?
Had the head done on my 885i a few years back, never had it re torqued and its been fine. A bit strange this torque then 90 degree stuff, but I did the head on my wife's saxo a bit back using the same method tho to about 140 degrees on final...been fine so far.
I've got about 1,000 miles on the Tiger at this point, not bad considering I've been deployed a few weeks. It's been running good, no overheating and no coolant loss. Even stays in the middle of the temp gauge in traffic.
I'm getting to the point where I feel like I can trust the bike again, which I hadn't been able to do for a while.
:wheel