(https://photos.smugmug.com/Tiger-Engine-Rebuild/i-5c5cvwM/0/95b0bc39/X3/IMG_2336-X3.jpg)
After borrowing my buddy's clutch tool, I finally got the cases split and the transmission shafts out.
I do have some questions if any of you have been here before me:
1- In the manual, it says to line up the dots on the balancer gears so that the single dot is between the opposing gear's two dots while at TDC. I did not have to disturb the balance shafts or remove those gears, but I did notice that they never align as described in the manual. Since it was running just fine, I'm not touching it, but I was curious about it?
2- I wore brushed the cylinder liners to remove the rust and general grunge, and noticed that sleeve #1 was oriented with the printed number facing front, while sleeve #3 was just the opposite. Since they must be symmetrical, I guess the engine builder just randomly put them in like that?
3- Pistons have been soaking in kerosene for two days, but the carbon is still stuck tight on the tops. I used just a toothbrush and kerosene for fear of damaging them, but clearly I have to use something stronger. I remember reading about MEK in another thread?
4- I took the head to a machine shop that is about 50 miles away, as I have none closer that can do this work. The machinist is very knowledgeable, and said he didn't understand why the valve guides could not be replaced, as they looked like most other metric heads he has seen? He is going to disassemble the head in a few days, and give me a list of anything that needs replacing. He did say that because he is doing the valves one at a time, it will likely be even better than when it left the factory, and should have lots of miles left in it.
He can't do anything with the cylinder sleeves, as he has no jig to hold them properly. Thus, I just cleaned them up with a wire brush.
In addition to the head, he recommended that I buy new sleeves and piston sets, as this would put the entire top end in brand new condition. I have mulled this over quite a lot, as I don't have that kind of money right now, and realize that all of that work can be done in the future if necessary, with the engine in the frame, without all of this engine pulling nonsense. The engine was running fine, using no oil, and getting great gas mileage.
However, when I consider what a new bike payment would cost, it seems like a good investment to insure the longest possible issue free life out of this bike, which will probably be my last. I've also been having some conversations with Sparky, who did his top end not long ago, and his choice was to freshen just the rings. So there is a middle ground as well.
To summarize, here are my choices:
1- Replace liners and piston sets. Expensive, but restores engine to like new condition. Adds about $800 to the cost.
2- Replace just the rings. Adds about $165 to the cost.
3- Put all the old stuff back in. Adds nothing to the cost.
I could also replace just the liners (adds $300), or just the piston sets (adds $500), but assume doing one without the other is not a good idea, as they wear in together?
So, I know Mustang's sage advice is "if it ain't broke, don't even think about it", and I understand that, and that is the direction I am leaning towards. Any of you want to encourage me to replace the lot while I am this far into it?
PS- I am getting sick of working on it. Can't wait to have it back together and ride the damn thing at least once before snow flies again!
Three marks on my balancer shafts weren't perfectly aligned either and Clive Woods opinion on the subject and he's done a lot, in this case close enough is good enough.
I wouldn't worry about getting the piston crowns perfect, it won't matter after running for 5 mins.
If the ring gaps are good, no scuffing on the pistons and the original hatch marks on the bores are still visible, I'd be inclined to put it back as is and spend the money on gas :wheel
I think the story about not being able to change the seats comes from the fact that they were heart shrunk in originally.
Thanks Sin.
Some shiny strips in the liners, but nothing you can feel, and still cross hatching visible even under the polished areas.
Some scuffing along the top leading edge of the pistons.
Sparky mentioned that Clive always replaces the wrist pins?
Your recall is better than mine, that's right, apparently they wear faster than the pistons :icon_scratch:
WD40 cleaned my pistons up nice on my Super3. After some debate and advice on here,I replaced the original liners,and rings. After 50k miles,cross hatch was still visible,and no 'lip' at the top of liner. I checked top ring gap in relevant liners,and they were on bottom spec.. 0.2-0.41 mm,but apparently you can go up to 1mm? No sharp edge on rings,which is another sign of wear? Saved me a lot of money,and if it needs doing again in the future,only means the cost of a head gskt?
Just to be clear, you put in new rings and liners, and the measurements you list were these new parts after 50,000 new miles on them after installation?
Engine had covered 50k,but the inlets were 'shot',so needed changing.I only bought 'new' inlet valves and stem seals. Re used everything else. Ring gap measurements were original rings in the original liners. I didn't remove pistons.
Ah, now I get it😊
When you said "replaced" I interpreted this as new ones.
You meant replaced as in reinstalled.
Tricky quirks between English usage and American usage sometimes!
You haven't figured in the Welsh and the Scots just to confuse the issue further :icon_lol:
I did almost exactly the same as Threepot, "refitting" all the original powerpot components and only renewing the inlets as well but at a mileage just shy of 85k miles.
I'm tempted to strip the top end on my steamer just to change the head gskt. Not that there's anything wrong,but the gskt on my Super3 was in a bit of a state. And I've also noticed how mechanically quiet it's become since the valve job. I started it up recently,and the engine sounds really smooth. Whereas the tiger sounds like a diesel when cold :icon_wink:
After 21yrs,and 50k miles
What's yours like ssevy?
I just got back from the machine shop. All 3 pistons are under the size specs, and the liners have a serious corroded ring along the top lip from where the head gasket lies. My machinist said it might be possible to mill .010 off the top to create a better sealing surface for the head gasket, and make this up with a shim at the base so it remains tight between the block and the head. The interiors of the liners are still good. This would leave it possible to install new liners if needed in the future. He could also mill the block .010 to match the liner spacing, but then any future liner replacement would mean machine work before they would fit.
He strongly recommends installing new stuff instead of trying to "get by" with the old, but he does understand the cost issue, and spent lots of time measuring and inspecting everything to see if reusing was feasible. Of course, using new parts means he makes less money on the job as well, and he is really smart, so I do trust his opinion.
I guess at this point I will bite the bullet, order new stuff and make some credit card payments each month for awhile :icon_cry:
Thanks for all of the input!
Where will you place shim?
It would go at the base of the liner, but I'm buying new ones I guess.
I'm impressed thats one massive job your undertaking. Dose any ride these bikes or just work on them I know thats all I'v done.
Search Ssevy's ride reports and you'll know why he lavishes attention on the bike :icon_wink:
Right you are :5moped
This thread is deceiving, as it makes my Tiger sound like a PIA, which it is not. This wound was self-inflicted, and had I not buggered the bearing, I am sure that none of this would have been necessary for many, many more miles. I like to ride long distances, and have always done so with no worries on this bike, and I am sure that once she is all back together again, there will be many more miles to enjoy. Don't let my experience scare you off :icon_wink:
A few more random thoughts:
1- The Steamer is my favorite looking bike of all time. It looks capable of anything. I was incredibly lucky to find this '95 only 60 miles away with 17,000 miles on it and for only $2500.
2- I would not swap it for a new model, as it is old school in design, and I can work on it (with help from the collective here :icon_redface:)
3- The Shinko tires work fantastic on this bike, and are cheap as shit to run.
4- I have my Tiger modded and accessorized exactly as I want and need it, and it serves its role as long distance back road touring platform perfectly.
5- When you enjoy years without any monthly bike payments, having to invest some capital into it on occasion is inconvenient, but not a deal breaker. I can still remember spending big bucks fixing cars while still paying monthly payments on them :icon_cry:
6- I enjoy riding something unique. Aside from Mustang's herd, I have seen only one other Steamer on the road.
7- Lastly, this bike is 22 years old. Shit may happen, but with my toolkit and the wizards on this forum, I fear nothing :icon_mrgreen: