04 Tiger intermittent running fault

[Lone-Tiger]

Hey, Im having a really annoying intermittent running fault with my 2004 955i Tiger...

Fitted with TOR silencer (Triumph TOR ECU map loaded) and K&n filter, iridium plugs

Starts from cold no problem, idles and set off on a ride without a problem...however when you stop, for a leg stretch or for fuel thats when the problem occurs....restart and idle no problem but when you try to roll the throttle to take off it bogs down and stalls unless you give it a hand full of revs...it then runs really rough like theres a misfire for a while and eventually clears itself...the time it takes to clear varies and it doesn't bog down and stall every time you shut off or restart.

this has been on going for the last 6 months or so and before this the bike ran perfect. recently the mil light came on with fault codes P0201 and P1201 as well as P0203 indicating an injection fault however this fault clears itself and doesn't show up all the time, just intermittently. Ive plugged in Tuneecu and all injection pulses are around the same values. swapping injectors makes no difference to the fault codes.

Things I've checked:

All wiring and connectors from the ECU all the way to the injectors

tank breathers (water drain was blocked, so have cleared that)

earth points and cables

idle vacuum valve and hoses (replaced hoses as a few were slit at the ends), valve moves up and down as it should.


Things I've changed:

Fuel filter

2nd hand plug top coils ( all three had small splits in the casings )

2nd hand injectors ( on replacing these the faults still indicated a fault with injector 1 and 3 )



Any help with a point in the right direction would be most appreciated!! 

Cheers

Lone-Tiger

[motoOzarks]

Juicy

Great write up

Try introducing yourself and where your from. 

[Bixxer Bob]

The codes all point to a wiring fault on the injector concerned and the symptoms indicate intermittent open circuit.  You've ckecked the injector end so its likely to be at the ECU end.  I've attached the manual test procedure.

I'm also picking up on the blocked water drain.  If it was like that for any length of time and you ride anywhere but a desert, you'll have water in the bottom of the tank.  I'd look there first, I had about half a pint in mine.   It coughs and complains till the water level in the fuel drops below the pickup point then it's ok till the next time water gets in.  Doesn't fit all of your issues, but it's a start.

[Lone-Tiger]

Thanks for that.. i'll try and check it this afternoon...as for the water that might be in the fuel...ill totally drain the fuel tank including below the pick up and refill with fresh.

[Bixxer Bob]

   I'd be looking for corrosion in the connectors at the ECU (while you're in there, whip it off and check there's no water damage underneath it.  For reasons I can't explain Triumph put lots of holes in the undertray which allow water to attack the electrics from underneath) and also at the loom plug shown in the wiring diagram.

A long while back Chairhead had a major issue in his ECU plugs which caused some burning and stranded him in Europe so it's not unknown....

Failing that, check the relevant parts of the loom along it's length for chaffing.  Oh, and the fuse for that circuit; the injectors share the ECU fuse which means if you have a problem there, the ECU supply is intermittent too.

[Lone-Tiger]

Update...have stripped look tape from the entire loom and found no breaks or rubs, broken wires etc. removed ECU, fuse box and relay holders...found some corrosion on fuse box and relay holders so replaced fuse box and relay holders with new...

No difference was made still intermittent bogging down on restart...have hooked up the fuel tank remotely and am able to observe the fault in the garage...still no further forward after checking all sensors which are within specs.

As soon as you give it the smallest of throttle it begns to bog down and then die...one thing I did notice is that the outer of the two inlet valves in cylinder 1 and 3 are dirty on the back of the valve...while both of cylinder 2,s are immaculate...might be a something or nothing as the injector faults are showing up in 1 and 3.

Again any help would be great

Cheers

Lone Tiger

[Bixxer Bob]

The fact that the sooty valves line up with the fault codes is good.  Your swapping injectors around and the fault codes remaining static kind of point to the problem being at the connectors rather than the injectors themselves but since it's only one of two valves on each cylinder suggests injector spray pattern. Sooty=rich = either injector is sticking open (commensurate with corrosion due to water in the fuel) or short circuit opening the injector when it shouldn't be.  If it's a short, it's somewhere between the connection on the injector and the ECU because a short before the injector would mean no fuel to the cylinder and a blown fuse.   

You are obviously in the right area, but you have to just work out which bit it is. 

[Lone-Tiger]

Thanks Bixxer Bob for your help...I made up a bypass wire, cut into the relevant wires as near to the ECU plug as I could and unplugged the injector 1 connector and plugged in the bypass, this made no difference and the problem came back after a couple of restarts.

Its a really annoying problem the fact that its so intermittent and doesn't happen all the time, another thing i forgot to say is that the head gasket is ever so slightly seeping coolant from the rear of the head on cold mornings but this seems to be the "normal" with some tigers.

Im going to check compression this week and check valve clearances as well.

might set up the injectors and fuel rail off the bike and observe the spray pattern and if any of the injectors are leaking.

If I had to put money on it...I would have said it was electrical but I just can't find it!!

Cheers

Brendan

[Bixxer Bob]

you said earlier that swapping the injectors around made no difference and that the fault codes stay with 1 & 3 so I don't think it's the actual injectors, but go ahead and look, there's nothing like being sure.  If you've eliminated the wiring for 1 & 3 to the ECU that just leaves the ECU plug.

On my bike I'd be swapping the ECU for my spare about now to see if that made any difference, but I realise it's not helping you.

[Lone-Tiger]

So it turned out to be the ECU that was at fault, got a replacement from Ebay... just been out for a run with plenty of stop and restarts and no problems what so ever...after I verified it was the ECU in the garage I also balanced the throttle bodies and replaced the IACV hoses with silicon...runs better than ever!

Thanks to Bixxer Bob for his help.

[Mustang]

 

[Bixxer Bob]

When you eliminate the likely, whatever is left, however unlikely, is the solution.  Or something like that.  Glad it's fixed anyway!