help please

[pastyman]

i was travelling to london yesterday trying to get to the 02 to see iron maiden when the bike just lost all power and died, i pulled onto the hard shoulder and tried to restart it and nothing happened, eventually the bike started again and ran for about another 50 miles and again it died.

now apart from stripping down the carbs and giving them a good cleaning can anybody suggest any thing else i can do

oh and incase you were wondering i never made it to the gig    

[MIMbox]

Hi PastyMan, sorry to hear your tale of woe. Lots of advice available on this site. If it was carbs, it would probably have been fuel starvation, did it just die suddenly?. Tank vent can be clogged, as can inline filter, located inside supply pipe at point where it enters carbs.
Most problems seem to be with coils giving up under heat/load, but symptoms seem to be that bike appears to run on less than three cylinders, but if you wind the throttle open it will bog down, then come on like a train in higher revs, probably due to less energy needed to spark.
Replace with TT600 coils is the most cost effective solution, as any used ones will do the same, in all likelyhood.
Ignitor, or  timing sensor is favorite, symptoms are that bike will die suddenly and completely, but will restart later and run for some time. Seem to fail at around 45K. About £40 from ebay.
Actual CDI unit is less of an issue, but things like sidestand switch can fail over time, so thank Bruce Dickinson for metal, (although I am a Sabbath era Headbanger!) and start enjoying Triumph ownership MWAHAHAHAHAH

[Rocinante]

Pick up coil is my guess. It fails when it gets warm when the metal expands. Then it contracts again while cooling down and will run fine for a while before repeating the process. Quick and cheap fix, but not something one carry along.

[MtheTiger]

I don't think its the pickup sensor 'cause it did 50 miles before it stalled again. When I had a bad sensor I could barely ride 3 kms before I had to wait for 10 minutes to let it cool down enough to start again....
When it stalls, does the rev counter goto zero ?

[bjago]

Hey some bike history might help

-- Length of ownership?
-- Current miles on the bike?
-- Service history?


My guess is if the bike has more than 50K miles and you have been riding the bike off and on for the majority of the riding season.... I would aim your round at the pickup coil as well.

The symptoms sound almost exactly like mine did when it first started to fail.

Good Luck and keep us posted

[Mustang]

^^^^

[aeronca]

 +1.

[pastyman]

-- Length of ownership?   less than 2 weeks
-- Current miles on the bike?  37k
-- Service history?  reasonable

recent work done (taken from sale add) - UPRATED CAMS AND FOLLOWERS, ALL VALVE CLEARANCES AND SHIMS DONE AT BIKE SHOP NOT 12 WEEKS AGO, THE STANDARD CAMS COME WITH THE SALE, THE CDI HAS BEEN UPRATED ALSO - i noticed on this though that both of the snorkels were uncovered, would this affect anything now that this work has been done

when it was about to die i could just feel that it was gone and throttle when wide open seemed to stay at about 5k revs. when the bike came to a stand still, i also noticed that i was very difficult/almost impossible to get the neutral light to show.

bike would also not start unless clutch lever was pulled in, both with stand up and down

when bike did start again it would rev all the way up to redline, also when on tickover and then gave it a bit of throttle bike sounded like it was misfiring

i hope thats better info for everyone and thanks for the help so far  :D

[GavD]

I had similar issues when getting my '98 running again after a 4 year lay up. My pick up coil was definately gone as bike would run for 10 mins then just die, let it cool down for 20mins then restart and run for another 10 mins.
After pick up was changed still had running problems, which I basically sorted by fitting some TT600 coils from ebay(£40) and rejetting to Mustangs recommended settings (Keihins on mine, Mikuni's on yours). Also had carbs off (keep them banked together though) and flushed them out with carb cleaner a few time.

All in all, this probably cost about £100.

[CoolHandLuke]

-- Length of ownership?   less than 2 weeks
-- Current miles on the bike?  37k
-- Service history?  reasonable

recent work done (taken from sale add) - UPRATED CAMS AND FOLLOWERS, ALL VALVE CLEARANCES AND SHIMS DONE AT BIKE SHOP NOT 12 WEEKS AGO, THE STANDARD CAMS COME WITH THE SALE, THE CDI HAS BEEN UPRATED ALSO - i noticed on this though that both of the snorkels were uncovered, would this affect anything now that this work has been done

when it was about to die i could just feel that it was gone and throttle when wide open seemed to stay at about 5k revs. when the bike came to a stand still, i also noticed that i was very difficult/almost impossible to get the neutral light to show.

bike would also not start unless clutch lever was pulled in, both with stand up and down

when bike did start again it would rev all the way up to redline, also when on tickover and then gave it a bit of throttle bike sounded like it was misfiring

i hope thats better info for everyone and thanks for the help so far  :D

If the rev counter is showing 5K then it is not the pickup coil (if the pickup coil goes, the revs drop to zero).

The description of being able to start it with the clutch pulled in, regardless of sidestand position, sounds like a sidestand switch or sidestand relay problem.

There is a way to bypass this issue.

If you lift the seat up, there is (presuming no alarm fitted) a connector block with a single black wire sticking out of it.  Connect this wire to earth and this effectively bypasses the problem.

[pastyman]

well quick update - i stripped all the fairing today and armed with a fluke i attacked all of the ignition circuit and tested it all for continuity and resistance and all checked out ok and all within tolerances.

i did notice that when i was putting it back together and doing quick ignition tests that only the number 3 exhaust was getting hot, so i thought aha its coils 1 &2 coil is shot but i disconnected the coils and swapped them around but to no avail.

i have now disconnected the carbs and will be stripping them down tomorrow for a dam good clean

will keep you updated with the progress  :D

edit - does anyone in the uk have a spare airbox cap as from what i have read on here it needs to have both and i dont have any

[CoolHandLuke]

You get faltering at 5k RPM if both sides of the airbox chamber are open.  

You only need to block the right hand side, the left hand side should have a curved air intake.

The caps are quite cheap, though you could use a plastic bag and an elastic band for the short term.

[pastyman]

cheers for the airbox info

well heres another update - stripped the carbs down today and what an event that was when they were in bits the 2 of the pilot jets were completely blocked, and whats best described as cheese was in the float bowls  :D  so spent a good afternoon with a can of carb cleaner, compressed air and some thin stransds of wire, and can defo rule them out now.

Then back to reassembly and all i can say is whoever designed the airbox/carb configuration needs to be shot lol

well the bikes all back together now and seems to be ticking over  and running better, still not right but better
final thing now its all back together is take it all apart as the throttle cable is sticking

oh the joys of buying british  :roll:  :roll:

[CoolHandLuke]

There are a lots of "interesting" design choices on these early bikes :)

Good to know you have it running better.  Did you get chance to balance the carbs whilst it was all apart?

[pastyman]

nah going to wait till a bloke in work comes back from his hols with a proper vacuum balancer