Petrol with Ethanol (E10 etc) and Steamers . .

[richierich75]

I was just wondering what other Steamer owners are considering to do now most petrol (in the UK at least) has Ethanol added (currently 10%, known as E10)?

This dam stuff attacks the jets (brass), alloy (carb bodies), rubber (fuel pipes and o-tong seal), plus worst of all the nylon-6 from which the fuel tank is manufactured.

In the case of tanks, this effect any Triumph with a plastic tank, and already cases of tanks expanding in length due to the permeability of Ethanol vapour to Nylon-6. Also paint finish lifting and bubbling effects. Apparently Triumph moved back to steel tanks in 2008, (which can still have issues because the ethanol goes through phase separation, and is highly hydroscopic, so the water sinks to the bottom of the tank and rots the steel), and I believe since 2014 coat the inside of the steel tanks due to ethanol content in petrol.

In the USA, Ducati also used nylon6 tanks (made by Acerbis, like Triumph's are) and there was a law suit, which resulted in replacement steel tanks been issued under a recall.

There are resin coatings available, but there seems to be doubt regarding whether these resins can resist ethanol. Plus how do you ensure a uniform coating thickness?

Personally i think either a fuel bag made from ethanol proof fabric (Continental make such stuff for motor racing and aerospace), is a good solution, although not sure how or where I could get one made. Or a replacement steel tank, which would probably be hand made (and cost a fortune) are the ultimate solutions. Or use AVGAS100 which I understand doesn't have ethanol added due to be aviation fuel, but hardly readily available or convenient!

Has anyone else got any ideas?

[nickjtc]

  with everything you say. The tank on my bike has 'grown' by at least a centimeter which is evidenced by the necessity to re-locate the mounting screw holes. We have one fuel chain here that sells fuel without ethanol, but for how much longer remains to be seen. I put fuel stabilizer in the tank if I think the bike is going to sit for more than a week without being used.

[ram33]

afaik total do not use ethanol in their petrol (yet)

[GavD]

So it's just a matter of time before we all start buying this kit is it?

http://www.caferacerkits.co.uk/product/crk900-kit/

Think it'll look any good with long forks, spoke wheels and high bars?

[John Stenhouse]

Just to clear one thing up from your statement, there is currently only 5% ethanol in UK fuel.The introduction of E10 is on hold at the moment.

[nickjtc]

So it's just a matter of time before we all start buying this kit is it?

http://www.caferacerkits.co.uk/product/crk900-kit/

Think it'll look any good with long forks, spoke wheels and high bars?

Not for the Tiger though, thank goodness. We don't want to see any of our beloved Tiggers changed from the wonderful beasts they are, do we??  :icon_wink: :icon_wink:

[nickjtc]

Just to clear one thing up from your statement, there is currently only 5% ethanol in UK fuel.The introduction of E10 is on hold at the moment.

We have to live with 10% and some new vehicles are being made to accept 15%.

[stuartw]

I have used e10 in both a Sprint st and my current Tiger 955. I have noted little difference in throttle response and no change in engine temperature. If I think I am going to leave the bike for more than a day or two I fill up with 98 super. I accidentaly put half a tank of e85 in the sprint once and filled up with super the next day as the power significantly dropped away. Hardly scientific but my experiences so empirically valid?

all best stuartw

[FoothillRyder]

FWIW, I add several oz. of Stabil Ethanol Treatment to the tank whenever my bikes are going to be parked for more than a few days. Where I live (in the colonies), the fuel is pretty much all E15.

It's bad sh*t, that's for sure!

[richierich75]

Just to clear one thing up from your statement, there is currently only 5% ethanol in UK fuel.The introduction of E10 is on hold at the moment.

I'm not sure, petrol that complies to Bs EN 228:2008 may contain up 10% ethanol. On the pumps at the Total station I use the unleaded is to this standard.

Found this from the MCIA:-

http://www.mcia.co.uk/Campaigns/Introduction-of-E10-fuel.aspx

[ssevy]

Here in the United States we have had E10 for a long while. There's a product here called Star Tron which is the best ethanol treatment I have found. I also installed a tank sealer made by the New York State company called Caswell. So far so good.

[Mustang]

you should see the bonneville carbs I have on the bench
they got gas treatment before parking and forgot about .
The fuel in the bowls evaporated at some point in time and everything that was able for the gas treatment to get at is now green .
the plastic floats are green the main jet and pilot jet are not only green but they are fuzzy too .
so even gas treatment fails (it may well have been star tron as thats what I use normally )
Moral of the story
there is no sure fire storage solution for ethanol gas .

[threepot]

Ethanol is 5% in the UK at the moment. If your not intending to use your Steamer for a while,it is easy to drain the tank. Then run the engine,til the carbs drain. Too bad we are thinking this way!!! We should complain more!
Yes,and my tank has expanded,so I have to re drill the 2 mounting bolts at the rear!!
I have read that some fuel manufacturers are putting in the ethanol into their transport tankers,after it leaves the refinery! To prevent the corrosive effect it will have!

[richierich75]

I've done more research and well seems there isn't a practical solutions. I'm not sure about resin coatings because as an amateur how do ensure a consistent coating?

For me sadly I feel quite despondent about the Tiger.. I think it's time to sell ,annoying as I've had it since 1998 and really like it, but this an issue I (nor any of us?) cannot solve...

[Danwarb]

I'm saving up for a KTM 990 adventure.

As much as I love my steamer I can't get used to the bag of nails sound the engine has !

Top that with the fact that it looks like my bike is going to melt away from the petrol these days . . .