Battery goes down at High RPM´s (bike dead in the highway)

[german]

Well, this item is known for some of us, my electrical problem continues, after riding around 5 hours none stop, the battery goes down, the bike electrically dead in the highway, this problem has around 1 year,  battery, stator  and regulator were replaced.
I have measured the stator /regulator output, I have seen that the voltage goes down at high RPM 5-6k supplying less than 12dcv.

the OEM did not find anything abnormal in the bike.

We will appreciate your suggestions / comments.

Best regards.

[aussietiggar]

Had the same problem with my 2005 Tiger, tested circuits fitted new battery, nothing changed.
To solve my problem I just made up a plug and lead to connect a battery charger to the bikes power out let, If I have not ridden the bike for a week I charge for 30mins or there about's no problems.
After talking to people about the issues there seems to be two opinions.
1) The batterys used do not accept charge if the alternator output is two low, ie the battery is flat and all the load, lights, ignition and heaters are just running off the alternator.
2) The alternator regulator does not turn on if the battery is flat anyway, by charging for 30mins increases the battery float level, the alternator see's the higher voltage and charges as it is supposed to.
The above is theroy if any body can offer something else very pleased to hear it.

[Stretch]

I'm having trouble with mine as well.  I saw German's post here right after he posted it, but I didn't have anything concrete to post about my own situation (still don't, really, but I am working on it).

To summarize, my regulator / rectifier died while I was in the middle of a Tennessee / Mississippi TransAmerica Trail ride.  I replaced the stator on the roadside, thinking that was the problem, but the charging system still wouldn't work.  Since I didn't have a spare regulator with me, and we didn't have the time to order the part, the trip was over.  I brought the bike home in a rented moving van.

I installed the new regulator and a new battery a few days later, and the bike still isn't charging like it should.  I'm getting 12.8 - 13 volts at highway speeds, down to 12.1 - 12.2 at idle.  The voltage readings get worse as the engine gets hotter.  At this point, I can't take the bike on trips longer than an hour or two, and I have to re-charge the battery every couple of days to keep it above 12 volts.

I suspect that I cooked part of the new stator by running it for an hour or so with a bad regulator.  I just bought a new digital multimeter in order to run some tests on the bike.  I'll post my findings here.

But I think that a person should replace the stator and regulator as a set, to avoid having problems with the 'surviving' part later on.

[Mustang]

I suspect that I cooked part of the new stator by running it for an hour or so with a bad regulator.  .

Or you just had another fine example of a stator from triumph as a spare  

[Stretch]

Nope, the spare was from Electrosport, which also enjoys a semi-dubious reputation.  I didn't know this until after I bought it.

I got the regulator from Rick's Motorsport Electrics.  They enjoy a pretty good reputation, so I'll be buying a stator from them and matching it with their RR.  We'll see how that goes.

[TigerTrax]

Is Triumph so fond of its days with Lucas......
they are recreating that nostalgic era so we will buy their 'nostalgia jackets and shirts?

I haven't enough time to rant about electrics with so much to rant about brakes, suspension, centerstand, et al!~

Ohshitus Tigris Electricitious

[Stretch]

Today I changed the Regulator / Rectifier bracket around a bit so I wouldn't have to remove the battery and battery box and all the tank bolts in order to lift the back of the tank, just to get at the lower RR bolt (with 18 inches of socket extensions from the other side of the bike).  

Whoever put the RR there ought to be flogged.

Now I can get at the RR and its bolts by merely removing the seats and the left side panels, and it gets the same amount of airflow as it did before.

Airflow around the RR is another issue I'll be addressing shortly.  It's tucked up inside the frame, between the frame spar and the tank, with only about a half-inch of space on the front and back of the RR, and the only air it gets is hot air coming off the cylinders, head, and case.  I'm thinking about adding some vents to the body-colored side panel in order to get cool air into the space behind it.


As for the parts themselves, we are fortunate that we're not stuck with Triumph® as the sole supplier of charging system parts.  In my internetal wanderings, I've found that a couple Hondas use very similar RR's, and practically identical stators (I wouldn't be surprised if the Japanese manufacturer were the same), as well as the aftermarket replacement pieces from Electrosport and Rick's Motorsport Electrics.

The downsides of the Electrosport stators are that the wires have no connectors fitted, although they are included for you to cut and set up yourself.  It is clearly a universal-fit G75 stator, intended to be used on any bike that calls for a G75 (or equivalent size) stator.  Also, the rubber plug found on the Triumph and Rick's pieces is not present on the Electrosport.  You must use silicone sealer, etc. to seal the stator wires where they come out of the engine.



I believe Rick's to be the better value, as the prices of the Electrosport and Rick's stator are about the same, in the neighborhood of $130-150 USD, but the part from Rick's has the wires already cut to length, spade terminals installed, and the proper connector and rubber seal fitted.  I've also not read of any quality-control complaints concerning Rick's parts.

As posted earlier, I'll be removing the Electrosport stator and replacing it with a new one from Rick's, as well as a new Rick's RR, just to have both parts brand-new (each never having been mated to a shorted or failing partner).  The battery is less than two weeks old, and I've been maintaining its charge.

Also, Rick's offers a one-year replacement warranty on his stuff.  You won't find that on a Triumph electrical part - if you take it out of the dealer's front door, it's yours.

http://www.ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/
Note that Triumph applications are not listed on Rick's website, but they do stock parts for Triumphs.  Give them a call or e-mail.

So... it's not as bad as the Bad Olde Days of Lucas, Stromberg, et al, with nothing else available.

[AndyM]

The stator on my 03 Tiger failed at ~70k miles and I'm waiting on a replacement from Electrosport.  The RR tested fine so I'm not replacing it. Wish me luck. How does the output from Rick's compare with Electrosport? Electrosport claims 20% over stock.

[swamper650]

Stretch, I believe your assumption is correct. Running a new stator with a bum RR will take out the stator. I have had that experience with my 81 Suzuki 850G. A you are aware the charging system on that series is problematic.  I have owned the bike since new and have changed out a few. Found that changing out both parts at the same time was the way to go.

[Stretch]

Over the past couple days, I've been in e-mail conversations with other Tiger drivers from various forums who have experienced this problem, and they all say the same thing... replace the stator and RR at the same time to avoid one bad part frying the new one, and then flip-flopping every time you swap half of the system.

When you replace the alternator on a car (or a Steamer or BMW), you replace essentially the whole charging system except the wiring... the stator (and rotor) and RR are all housed together and replaced en masse.  (The 955 rotor is just a magnet bolted to the end of the crankshaft, and shouldn't ever need replacement).  

Since aftermarket parts are available from Electrosport and Rick's at a fraction of the cost of Triumph® parts, why not replace everything (except the rotor) at once and be done with it?

Anywho, that's the way I'm going.

Swamper, during my recent internet readings on charging systems, I have read of problematic charging systems on Suzuki GS's.  Have aftermarket suppliers been able to iron out the design gremlins?

Andy, I don't yet know the specifics regarding output numbers on the various brands.  I'm curious how Electrosport claims a 20% increase in output, when they don't post the actual wattage rating of their part.  The 2005 Tiger alternator is rated at 35 amps (420 watts at 12v), according to my manual.  

There's nothing on Rick's website about wattage ratings for his replacement parts, so I'm going to have to try and get a technician on the phone and ask him.

[swamper650]

I installed Electrex components into my GS and have found  them superior to OEM. The units are wired differently to disapate the excess charge. I also made  a direct ground from the RR to the frame.  Have over 20k on these units , the OEM units only had a 12k service life,

[Stretch]

I also made  a direct ground from the RR to the frame.

Okay, I'll be sure to do that also.

[AndyM]

Hi Stretch
When you tested your stator which test(s) did it fail? There are three tests for a stator.
1. resistance between leads, a-b, a-c, b-c.
2. short to ground, a,b,c
3. output @ 5000rpm, should be over 50vac and consistent between legs, a-b, a-c, b-c.

My stator passed the first two tests and failed the third with readings of 70vac on a-b, 68vac on a-c, and 10vac on b-c.  I checked it a little over a year ago and it passed all the tests.

I spoke with the tech at Electrosport about replacing the rr as well but decided not to as it tests good.

[Stretch]

My output between the legs at idle was about 8VAC, going up a bit at 3000 rpm, and then falling back off.  The other tests were OK.

I think I killed it by running it for an hour or so with the bad regulator.  

And now my new regulator is suspect because I ran it for a couple days with the weak stator.

I'm saying 'to hell with it' and replacing both (again) at once, starting over with a clean slate.

[german]

unfortunatly I am out of house, but for your ref, please find attached the following link.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/inde ... 9102&st=60