green road tax?????

[aeronca]

what is this crap????  this is what they want to do here!!!   http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id ... _article=1





copied from the drudge report:


Cars sit in traffic on a highway. The Dutch government said Friday it wants...

The Dutch government said Friday it wants to introduce a "green" road tax by the kilometre from 2012 aimed at cutting carbon dioxide emissions by 10 percent and halving congestion.
"Each vehicle will be equipped with a GPS device that tracks how many kilometres are driven and when and where. This data will be then be sent to a collection agency that will send out the bill," the transport ministry said in a statement.

Ownership and sales taxes, about a quarter of the cost of a new car, will be scrapped and replaced by the "price per kilometre" system aimed at cutting the Netherlands' carbon dioxide emissions by 10 percent.

"Traffic jams will be halved and it helps the environment," the ministry said.

Dutch motorists driving a standard family saloon will be charged 3 euro cents per kilometre (seven US cents per mile) in 2012. That would increase to 6.7 cents (16 US cents per mile) in 2018, according to the proposed law.

Every vehicle type will have a base rate, which depends on its size, weight and carbon dioxide emissions.

Taxis, vehicles for the disabled, buses, motorcycles and classic cars will all be exempt.

"An alternative payment will be introduced for foreign vehicles," the ministry statement added.

The Dutch cabinet approved the road tax bill on Friday. It will need the backing of parliament before it becomes law.

[TigerTrax]

Get used to it . . .
It's what the Commies in Washington want to do here also.

Don't be surprised to see states levy tolls on interstate highways.

The costs of being 'green' are pale compared to the 'full monte'.
You'll be just 'under' monthly financial survival by the time these bastards get done. And whatever is leftover, you can burn for heat . . it ain't worth much!

It's a 'whole new world' . . .  And some miserable bastards voted for it!

Yeah it's a political comment . . . so what!

. . . buy more ammunition . . . !

[aeronca]

more crap   http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/enviro ... wance.html

[Nick Calne]

You are right, what ever you think about it, it is going to happen eventually.  Suggest we get out there and ride while we still can.

[KuzzinKenny]

Check yer cage here...................

http://www.smmtco2.co.uk/co2search2.asp

KK

[zadok_oz]

We are all going to pay for this Global warming hysteria.  :roll:

[Colonel Nikolai]

I think it's a great idea: replacing a straight, unavoidable tax levy with a metered rate that I have some control over. I say give me more control, not less. That's what democracy is supposed to be all about (although government GPS scares the crap out of me: why not just use the odo?) It will make more people choose motorcycles and bikes instead of cages.

On that note, if only half of all Americans who could commute by bike did, we'd hit our Kyoto targets and then some without barely even trying. Not to mention riding would be safer if there were more riders on the road. Even if you don't "believe" in climate change (and want to wear your tin-foil hat) green energy and reducing energy consumption helps the economy by allowing more dollars to chase after innovation instead of going after vested interests like big oil and big energy. Not to mention funding terrorism at the gas pump, eh? And we like innovation, don't we? If for no other reason than we get to do the things we love cheaper and easier than we did before.

[aeronca]

im all for inovation, but i have a problem with govrnment. they see this strictly as a money maker and really dont give two shits about anything else. the govornment gets a new bureaucracy. the poloticians see it as a campaign slogan.  and the scientists who put out their theorys on this, see it as grant money to keep them employed at what ever institute they work for. its all one big circle, and in the end we - the tax payer(or govornment rape victim) end up paying for all this, and get told what to drive and when to drive it. hell there even going after the farmers for their cattle emisions. . there have been some cool advancements in technology because of this "global warming" theory, and im all for alternitive fuel, but i dont think the people pushing this these issues truley have our best intrests in mind when theres personal gain to be had. spent electronic equiptment leaves a far bigger carbon footprint on this planet than an suv.

[Nick Calne]

Well guys spare a thought for how this would work in the UK bearing in mind that:

If you buy a car you pay 17.5% VAT (sales tax), and cars are more expensive in the UK than elsewhere.

US Gasoline costs around $3 for 4 litres (roughly a US gallon)
UK Petrol costs around $7 for 4 litres

For an average car pays $320 for road tax per year
You gotta pay $60 ish for a MOT which is a road worthiness test
You have to buy insurance with insurance premium tax

OK ready to go somewhere? If I go to Cardiff there is a $9 toll to cross the bridge, If I go to London there is a congestion charge worth $13.  Then parking costs etc

Stop laughing!

If they introduce a pay per mile scheme it will definitely be ON TOP of these existing taxes bearing in mind the need for payment of the national debt.  If you don't think this is what will happen in the US then check out the size of your national debt; it is epic.  You are going to have to pay for it one day, plus your new healthcare scheme....this tax idea will cross the minds of those in Washngton I'm sure.

While I don't want global warming, I'm concerned that pay per mile may prove to be a tax on the freedom of movement...bad in the relative small UK, but in a big place like the states, it's going to be a particularly unfair... :shock:

[Sin_Tiger]

I think it's a great idea: replacing a straight, unavoidable tax levy with a metered rate that I have some control over. I say give me more control, not less. That's what democracy is supposed to be all about (although government GPS scares the crap out of me: why not just use the odo?) It will make more people choose motorcycles and bikes instead of cages.

You have control already, we all pay for our fuel and fuel is taxed, increase the fuel tax if you want to discourage driving or poor fuel consumption. This GPS crap is just a back door way of monitoring your movements period, they are just trying to legitimise it and keep more shiney arses in a job. Show me where the money is going and I will be a lot happier, it's certainly not going into public transport in the UK like they try to tell us. How many buses or Taxis run on LPG, only a few farsighted tour companies, in NZ, Japan and Korea it's mandatory, I'm fed up with getting stick all the time, I want to see some carrot's

Abolish road tax, as well while you are at it, buggest waste of resources going. And another thing, get MOT'd every year and the MOT station issues you a number plate, if you want a plate for your trailer or caravan take it to the MOT station where it can be checked, not safe, no plate.  :oops:

Sorry I went into Clarckson mode for a minute there, but really, do we need more beurocracy  :roll:

[TigerTrax]

THe major misconception about all of this is that some people actually believe that 'going green' will be better for us and solve alot of problems.
Well, it may be good intentions, but the ruination of an economy thru job loses, taxation on industry and citizenry, is beyond any
forseeable returned benefits of becoming 'greener'.

I say if you want to show me a 'greener' way of doing things or a better product, it had better perform equally as well and cost the same or less.

[Bixxer Bob]

The bit that I really don't get  in the "green" arguement is that, if you think back 20 years (if you're old enough) in industrial, or in fact in any big city in the uk, all the buildings were black - not the beautiful, clean stone finish that you see now - because they were covered in many many years of soot from coal fires and industry.  But we didn't have a global warming problem then....

I find it hard to believe that all the clean running vehicles we have now create more pollution than the domestic fires did then let alone the heavy industry making steel, coal fired electricity generation, production of coal gas, coke works etc etc, the list goes on.....  It just doesn't add up.  I'm not denying the evidence: receding glaciers, melting ice etc, I just don't see how it's all down to us.  

Also, the scientists have just owned up to a levelling off of global warming ie no increase, for the last eleven years, but they claim this is just a blip in their model.  I can see how if, in the face of that evidence, scientists suddenly admitted they'd made a mistake they'd have to give up their cosy research grants.  But they'd never let THAT get in the way of the TRUTH would they????

[oxnsox]

Personally I can't see the GPS monitoring working... at least in the short term.  I mean how do you implement something like that when you are talking about fitting to every vehicle.

Sure build the 'feature' into new stock if you like (I don't), but then you would have to give the rest of the national fleet years to become compliant.... oohh and lets not forget GPS doesn't always work in highrise areas or dense foliage......  
I'm with Sin-Tiger on this, if you have a plate you're good to go. In most countries you are paying an effective usage tax thru the petrol you use. More economic vehicle... less tax... Simple.

As an aside, down here in NZ land the Govt. is looking at putting up the annual registration fee for bikes (over 600cc) by US$550, about a 300% increase... its all health insurance related, but like a lot of riders I own more than 1 bike, even though I only ride one at a time. For me it means it will cost as much for the annual rego on the Girly as it does now for all my bikes (4).
And will it make riding a bike a safer experience..............

[Nick Calne]

$550 for an annual registration!  :shock:
What is the national motto of New Zealand?  Born free, taxed to death?

The high transport taxes only ever encourage tax dodging amongst the worst elements of society and resentment towards authority from the rest of us.

[TigerTrax]

Well. . .

Citizens have the RIGHT of freedom of travel and migration within their country without government oversight. A GPS on your automobile is not
freedom of travel without oversight. I would suggest the citizens make their voices heard:
1. GPS units are an OPTIONAL feature on all vehicles unless they are
    government vehicles.
2. Citizens wil NOT purchase any vehicle with a mandatory installed GPS that is monitored or travels habits accessible by the government for ANY
reason other than emergency.
 ( I guarantee you that when auto dealers feel the pinch of NO SALES,
they will be on your side).

3. As for increasing registration fees to 'supplement' healthcare costs,
   someone needs to demonstrate where the 'state' is in fact losing revenue at a rate far exceeding that of 4-wheel vehicles. They may be able to demonstrate the 'possibility' of more serious injuries, but can they prove the actual cost to the state vs costs paid by insurance and zero costs to the state.

We are living in a WORLD where civilized, industrialized nations have
attempted to be the 'mother to all citizens'. It affords them the 'need' to add layers of 'health & human services' to its citizens. And there is your BIG ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM that nobody sees.

Take a look at government bid requests. State or city level. You will find endless requests for: Specialists, Staff Personnel, and software to support every 'hand out' entitlement known to mankind. Take for instance things like: Legal Aid; New Mothers; ELderly Care, Nutritional Programs, Daycare Programs; Finding A Job Programs; I Can't Get My Finger Out Of My Nose Programs! Things right thinking and forward thinking people should be doing themselves. Taxpayers now have been delegated to support thanks to their 'legislators'.

Enough is enough! The worm is about to turn.

If they've take your guns . . . then your vote has no teeth.