Took the plunge!

[threepot]

I know this is a topic some of you dislike..but I serviced my Steamer today,and re-filled with car oil. I have been researching this issue for a while now,and have read some interesting reports,including experiences from people who have/work within the lubricant industry,and owners who have run bikes with car oil over long distances with no problems. The main thing I can make out is to avoid oil that is classed as 'energy conserving'. These are the oils with the anti-friction additives..which effect the clutch. It seems the best oils were manufactured up to 2001..API SJ/H. It seems these oils had the most concentrations of Phosphorous/Zinc which makes the anti-wear agent ZDDP. But the levels of this is reduced in modern oil(API SM/N) now to conserve catalytic converters. Anyway,I decided to give it a go. I have bought oil from a discount store..'Buyology'. It is Asda brand,classed as API SL,it states its for high performance engines,10w/40,not classed as 'energy conserving',and it cost £1.49 ltr. That means inc the cost of the filter..£3.50,I have serviced the bike for less than £9.50. I have run the bike today,performance is the same,gear change the same. The oil has probably been made for Asda by a leading manufacturer? A lot of modern cars have engines that rev high(Honda Type R). It doesn't state that you can't use this oil in that type of car!. Im going to see how it performs over the next few wks. Maybe it will prove that we are being ripped off??

[Bixxer Bob]

It can only cost you a clutch at worst.  After all, oil is oil, right?

(http://www.cheesebuerger.de/smilie.php)

[Nick Calne]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorcycle_oil

Hmmmm... Some science, some conjecture.

I used car oil for years with no ill effects whatsoever until someone told me it was a bad plan. (Ignorance is bliss) No one here to my knowledge is a specialist in lubrication chemistry so crack on and gather some evidence. Seems too cheap to be true. But on the other hand £20 a litre, which some oils are, is definately a rip off.  How can it cost that much?

That said my steamer is dear to me. So it now gets the best, waste of money or not.

[threepot]

I'll give you an example of this oil debarcle.. A friend of mine knows a chap who works for a main BMW car dealership. BMW were using Castrol GTX when servicing customers cars. They were getting so many complaints about the charges for oil(customers were saying they could buy the oil in Halfords etc,so much cheaper),they forced Castrol to change the wording on their packaging.
Shell sell a MINERAL oil which is suitable for 'moderate power output bike  engines'..Advance SX. Surely,a semi/synth will provide more protection? Bike or not. Oil companies know we love our bikes,and will spend what ever on them. I think they are taking us for granted (just like politicians).Quite simple..we are being ripped-off when it comes to bike oil. Don't tell me it costs double to manufacture,what is really the same product.
With regard to the clutch,if I notice slip,I will go back to a bike oil. I work with cleaning materials/chemicals etc,I'm confident I could clean the plates of any oil contamination? When you consider what those plates go thru,I'm sure a bit of cleaning wont do tham any harm? Watch this space!!

[Mustang]

[threepot]

Mustang,I take it youv'e a different opinion?  I raised this issue a while back,and you sent it to the 'Black Hole' If you havn't got an interest in it,leave alone..but I'm sure a lot of members ARE interested in this topic?? Its a lot more interesting/constructive  than some other topics on here. I may be a 'newbie' on this site,but Iv'e been riding and maintaining bikes/cars for 37yrs,Hinkley Triumphs for 17yrs. Changing the oil is the most important thing we do to our bikes..right?(Apart from riding them). So wouldn't it be of everyones interest if we could do it a lot cheaper? The trouble is we put up with all the shit they throw at us..fuel prices,taxes etc. We deserve all we get cos we dont complain enough!!! I'M TRYING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!! And I will contact a major manufacturer and ask them why there is such a difference in the price! I feel confident in confronting them.
I know someone who works within the lubricants sector. I will ask him to make some enquiries on this issue.

nickcalne..you were using car oil until someone told you not to! With no problems! Would you have continued using it?
I used to use car oil(20w/50) in my bikes 30 yrs ago..wet clutch..no problems,so did my friends,some with high performance bikes. Clutches havn't changed that much.            Don't make a fuss,just take it up the
There was a chap riding down the motorway/freeway on his Hyabusa,he pulls in to a service stn for fuel..checks his oil,its low.Thinks I need to top-up,he doesn't know anything about lubrication. Picks up a carton of oil..'Suitable for all high performance,multi-valved ,turbo/supercharged 4 stroke engines. 'This must be ok' he thinks.  Doesn't say its not suitable for a Suzuki Hyabusa engine though does it! Get my point.

[Mustang]

Mustang,I take it youv'e a different opinion?  I raised this issue a while back,and you sent it to the 'Black Hole' If you havn't got an interest in it,leave alone..but I'm sure a lot of members ARE interested in this topic?? Its a lot more interesting/constructive  than some other topics on here. I may be a 'newbie' on this site,but Iv'e been riding and maintaining bikes/cars for 37yrs,Hinkley Triumphs for 17yrs. Changing the oil is the most important thing we do to our bikes..right?(Apart from riding them). So wouldn't it be of everyones interest if we could do it a lot cheaper? The trouble is we put up with all the shit they throw at us..fuel prices,taxes etc. We deserve all we get cos we dont complain enough!!! I'M TRYING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!! And I will contact a major manufacturer and ask them why there is such a difference in the price! I feel confident in confronting them.
I know someone who works within the lubricants sector. I will ask him to make some enquiries on this issue.

nickcalne..you were using car oil until someone told you not to! With no problems! Would you have continued using it?
I used to use car oil(20w/50) in my bikes 30 yrs ago..wet clutch..no problems,so did my friends,some with high performance bikes. Clutches havn't changed that much.            Don't make a fuss,just take it up the
There was a chap riding down the motorway/freeway on his Hyabusa,he pulls in to a service stn for fuel..checks his oil,its low.Thinks I need to top-up,he doesn't know anything about lubrication. Picks up a carton of oil..'Suitable for all high performance,multi-valved ,turbo/supercharged 4 stroke engines. 'This must be ok' he thinks.  Doesn't say its not suitable for a Suzuki Hyabusa engine though does it! Get my point.

don't be so quick to jump to conclusions
your not the first to use car oil ...........
who exactly are you trying to convince ................yourself perhaps ?

[Nick Calne]

 

[threepot]

You could be right?  My conclusion is that forums and alcohol don't mix 

[Sin_Tiger]

I'll  to that

[sweller]

I've used generic no brand motor-factor car semi-synth 10/40 oil in nearly all the bikes I've had in the last 20 years.  Wet clutch or not.

I change both the oil and filter regularly and usually about 1000 miles before the service deadline.

I've had no clutch problems.

The only bike I don't use semi synth in is my old Guzzi which uses mineral 20/50. It drinks, spews up or otherwise consumes anything else.  Less since I replaced the rings but that's a different story.

[threepot]

No problems since changing the oil. In fact the box seems slicker?? I've spoken to a someone  who works within the lubricants industry.he says that the leading manufacturers..Castrol,Shell,Fuchs use the best BASE oils to start with,then add the additives,of which there are different qualities. And they over spec the oils to make sure they pass the API/JASO standards. I know this applies to the bike oils,but it probably applies to car oils. Less well known brands use lower grade base oil,then boost the spec with additives. The main reason I used car oil was to flush and clean engine. when I bought the bike,the oil was black. Probably not serviced for a while. I serviced with Castrol and a fresh filter. I recently bought some Petronas 10/40 bike oil which is on offer at M&P for £19.99/4ltr.  I'd have to spend at least the same for a quality car oil. But I wouldn't have any reservations about using car oil again.