Regarding Charging System Failures

[2aRover]

The maxi-fuse is in and the wire no longer gets warm.  I'm happy.  During the operation, I also installed a Datel voltmeter.  To switch it with the ignition, I added a relay that, when energized by the ignition switch, connects the Datel to the battery.  The relay drops about .5 volts, presumably due to contact resistance.  The voltmeter increases my confidence considerably, as I can see what's going on at any given moment.

This has been a good exploratory thread, and I appreciate every post.

[tokalosh]

This was a Tiger club I did NOT want to be a part of!  

Oh well, misery loves company and I'm in good company here.

Yes, I'm having charging issues too, and only after 20,000 km.  Mind you, I bought it from my father and he had "dead battery" issues while it was under warranty, so that makes me wonder if something was up long before and the dealer "solved" the problem.

Thanks to the Haynes manual and this fine forum of feline aficionados, I was able to isolate the problem to just the R/R.  

I figure I found it before a grounded wire shorted and spread to the stator because the alternator is pumping out a good 60 V (AC) at 4,000rpms (thanks for the info!), but it's sending less than 1.0 V (DC) from the R/R.

Now she's back in the garage while I wait for a new R/R from Rick's.

I'm going to try and mount the new one near the accessory plug, maybe seeking some professional help fabricating a suitable rig.  I figure with a better R/R in that position on the bike, with the cooling fins to the wind, she should be a-ok.

Any further wisdom out there?

[oxnsox]

You say you believe the stator is ok, and 60V would suggest it maybe..... but, have you checked each winding with an ohm-meter to determine that ALL of them are fine, and /or did you you check the output of each winding?

Reason I ask, if the R/R has failed and shorted, which seems to be the standard case, then it could have damaged 1 of the stator windings. The alternate option is that a shorted (or part shorted) stator winding will cause the R/R failure..... either way if you measure the stator output simply with a voltmeter you will probably see 60v, unless you check each winding separately OR use a scope.

It would be rare, me thinks, to catch an R/R failure without any damage being done to the stator.

[tokalosh]

damn oxnsox, you're freakin me out, man!  JK

i'm no electrician but i'm pretty confident with a multimeter... so let me run it past everyone.

before the R/R burnout, i'd  replaced and burped the cooling system.

before that, the Sasquatch bypass, and I hooked up an LED brakelight system with integrated brake flasher.

the thing about the brakelight is that it is based on two  voltage regulators, a 10V and a 12V, so if the source is less than 12V, the tail light looks dimmer (but flashes!) when you hit the brakes.  normally it works great, but the other day i swapped bikes so i could see the brakelight in action.  well, it was dim and on further inspection i figured it was the R/R.

maybe i did get really lucky  :shock:   ?

thinking about it now, doing a coolant flush and burp was a lot of running the bike while on it's centrestand--ie, not a lot of wind blowing up my Tiger's arse to cool that damn R/R.

with the recent tinkering in mind, i ran through the suggested diagnostics, including testing each prong of the 3-pin connector from the alternator plug for continuity and the alternator checked out fine.

should i crack the lid off the alternator and dig deeper?

should i send it in for a rewind / buy a replacement, just to be safe?

or trust my luck on a new R/R from Rick's and hope that i stopped the gremlins before they could fry the stator?

how hard is it to dismantle the alternator?

   and i was hoping for an easy start to the riding season.

[EvilBetty]

MOVED

How to change your Stator / Breather Seal
http://tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/msg,53241 (http://tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/msg,53241)

[tokalosh]

well, i guess if you're gonna do it, better do it right.


thanks for the breakdown.  


now let's hope the parts arrive before the beer runs out...

[AndyM]

Replacing the stator and breather seal gets easier the third or fourth time you do it  :lol:

[oxnsox]

Toka, not trying to give you palpitations just helping myself make sense of your diagnosis because we all have different ways of coming to our own conclusions.
If you measured the same volts on all three windings then you're right it does seem ok.

[tokalosh]

:D  no worries!  I'm just glad to get so much information and feedback from this group...

...I'm going to try to mount the new R/R like Tom Herold did, right beside the aux socket.

Results will be posted!

thanks everyone

[walker]

didn't think the 2006 had that breather tube? good write ups and info!

[EvilBetty]

It doesn't...  The 2006 (some late 2005's) has a labyrinth breather system, not the centrifugal system of the early 2005's and older.

I'm sorry I swear I checked his avatar and signature for a bike year but somehow I missed it.

[walker]

still a good writeup. I like thread with info and pics. Helps out a lot!

[EvilBetty]

Well fine... then I guess I better do it right and add some more pictures.  :)

http://tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/msg,53241 (http://tigertriple.com/forum/index.php/msg,53241)

[cbxtc6]

I've had 4 'modern' Triumphs now.  The Trophy was, and is, a great bike.  The Daytona is in my friend's garage now, zero issues.  My first Tiger, an '03 started having charging issues ~ 35k miles.  I replaced the stator, after discovering one of the phases was zero output.  Replaced that, to find my RR was fried.  Replaced the RR, worked for ~3k miles, then...yep - stator fried again.  I replaced with aftermarket Electrex unit.  I also replaced the regulator at the same time, and did the wiring 'mod'.  I traded the damn thing in because I no longer trusted it on longer rides.
  What did I trade it in for?  A new '06 Tiger.  The Tiger fits me, and my riding style.  I really can't think of another bike I'd rather have.
   So....I was coming home Sunday from the Mid-Ohio Vintage Daze, and my tach, etc all dropped to zero.  Yep.  No juice.  I went to the nearest Wally-mart - after having a Harley guy push start me  :oops: - and they charged and checked the battery for me (free).  Battery fine.  I limped it home, and checked things out when I got there.  Stator one phase gone.  Shit.  I'm going riding in SW Colorado in 2 weeks.  This time, I'm replacing both stator, and RR with the new "hotshot" one from Rick's (w/MOSFETs + $30).  
  Same model bike, same miles, same problems.  WTF?  Obviously, an engineering defect, since no other models of 955s seem to have this issue.  Heat?  Probably.  Design?  Definitely!  
  I love Triumphs, and always have.  If this doesn't fix the damn thing for good, I'm going to set it on fire where it breaks down, and NEVER buy ANOTHER!!!!!
  Triumph, are you listening???
 

Stay tuned.... :roll:

[ix]

Nice info in here.

I'm currently having a more subtle problem on my 2004  - the battery is very slowly running flat. I have to put the bike on a trickle charger over night every week or two. The battery is only about 1.5 years old, and the one before it lasted only a half year or so. Then yesterday I discovered that using my heated hand grips (Triumph part) no longer heats the hand grips much, but does drain the battery nicely. I'm guessing corrosion somewhere, or a worn/bad connection.  :(

I've never felt good about adding accessories onto this bike because of all the charging system issues (mine and others), but I'd really like to plug in heated clothing and run some accessory lights. Has anyone found a way to get a higher output stator on these bikes?